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Record: 6210 (3/13/2012)

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Macintyre vs Stoops

  • Good question... I think you may be right. I sure hope that's the case... I would feel better about him coming to UK

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  • MciNTYRE. I want to be sure about the offense more than the defense.Offense is what puts fannies in Commonwealth seats.But I fear the pun coming: Stoops to conquer!

  • I hate how people keep saying this...Besides the fact that he followed him at his 2 previous stops doesn't not make him a "disciple off the coaching tree"

    Altogether they have coached just ONE YEAR (2004) together before Butch ran off to West Virginia with RichRod. The only thing he has done related to Brian Kelley is win a lot of games with players that he recruited.

  • I know Don... I'm just stir crazy right now.panic

    Thanks! cheers

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  • Well.Minter...you pose a tough question. I agree with much of what you stated in your post.
    I think for Uk to even get consideration from a "BIG NAME" coach like Mark Stoops speaks volumes for Mitch as a salesman..youd think Stoops..having coached on BCS title winners..while at Miami when they were heads above the rest of college football..having fielded the best defense in the land..statistically...by yards (Bama is the best d in the land) hed have his pick of jobs.
    I would like to have Stoops. Hes a tough, defensive genius that has put a ton of db's in the NFL. He could coach up UK's talented young secondary. He has ties into the south..especially Fla..great recruiter..would put together a great staff.
    MacIntyre is also a defensive mastermind, that demands toughness from his teams. Mac has also proven he can take a bad team and make it a good one. SJst was one of the worst BCS progams in all of football..now they are what 10-2?
    All due fairness to Stoops...he has been spoiled in his coaching stops..he hasnt proven he can take a bad program and rebuild it.
    That said...my point is this..which do we need most? A coach that has turned a bad team around? Or a brand name coach with great ties and proven he can coach at elite level?
    I'll go with Stoops. I think his name alone helps UK..he would bring in a top tier staff, with all his connections...Mac did a great job at SJst, but Uk doesnt have the luxury of being in the talent rich state of Cal,
    Its great to know Stoops is condisering UK..things arent as bleak as one would think. I never really considered Stoops cuz I never though hed consider coming here. I think his name, his ties, his defensive genius would go a long way in turning Uk into a contender. Im glad to see that Mitch understands that UK needs a HC that will change the direction of our program..that guys with gimmicky offensive systems tend to fail in the SEC. It dosent take a genius to look at the best BCS teams and see..they play nasty defense..field power running attacks that throw off play action and out physical thier opponets...(Bama, LSU, ect)
    So..Stoops 4 me...but think Mac would be a great backup plan!

  • I say stoops has anybody looked at the defensive recruits they have pulled in since he has been there. i know it would be harder to sAle at uk but he can charlie strong like recruit.

  • By all reports, Kelly is out of the picture..said no. Imglad..the SEC is way tougher than the big East and think both Stoops or MacIntyre would fit Uk better.
    Mitch seems to understand Uk needs a HC that instills toughness...fundamentals, and a line up and whip you man on man type of intenisty to our program. I want a defensive guy. If your defense is great..you'll win the majority of your games. Stoops, Macintyre, even Doeren fit the bill. Chris Peterson is my #1...but Mark Stoops will do.

  • SJSU just finished the year and ended up averaging right at 40 pts per game on offense and gave up about 23 pts per game on defense. Neither stat is too bad IMO.

    This post was edited by sleepydog 17 months ago

  • WOW a Minter post with no agenda. Actually nice to read.

    If you can't recruit talent then you you only have a ceiling about like Rich Brooks had 7-5. I want more than that. Take a chance on Stoops and maybe he's every bit the program builder that Mac is plus he's plugged into the South and can get players.

    So I'm gonna say that Stoops is my #1 out of those two guys.

  • MIKE MACINTYRE???? fail

    MacIntyre hasn't reinvented the wheel at San Jose State. Dick Tomey did the same exact thing 7 years ago, except he did it one year quicker than MacIntyre.

    Tomey took over a San Jose State team that had won 2 & 3 games in the previous two seasons. He won 3 games in his first year, and then 9 games with a bowl win in his second season. Then he followed that up with 5 wins, 6 wins, and 2 wins before retiring in 2009. That's what a coach in the twilight of his career was able to do there, so I'm not thrilled with MacIntyre's record this year at all. At first you think "Wow, 9 wins at SJSU", but what Tomey did there puts it all in perspective. I mean, we are talking about a coach with only 4 years experience as a coordinator or higher, and 2 of those years were coordinating Duke's defense to a #60 & #61 total defense ranking. The only impressive thing I see about MacIntyre's entire career is this season, and I think it's the anomaly.

    My opinion is that the WAC is the type of conference that teams can have a good season here and there. Maybe it's because they were the team that had more seniors that year. Maybe they were the team that got lucky with one or two players and they ended up becoming way above the norm for that conference. A player similar to WKU's Bobby Rainey, who showed what only one great player can do for a team in a mid-major conference.

    If we were to hire Mike MacIntyre I think it would turn out like Joker, Dooley or Kragthorpe.
    badidea
    Rather than do that we would have been better off just sticking with Joker for one more year, at least we would have saved the couple million it cost us to fire him. MacIntyre shouldn't even be on our long list, much less near the top of it for God's sake.

    This post has been edited 2 times, most recently by jasonukfan 17 months ago

    “People who live in the past are afraid to compete in the present. There's no future in it.” -- Sparky Anderson

  • If it's down to Mark Stoops or Mike MacIntyre, it has to be Stoops. There's really no comparison.

    Mark Stoops has at least been coaching at major conference schools for the last 11 years. He's in a unique situation with three older brothers currently working as college coaches (2 at Oklahoma & 1 at Youngstown State). The Stoops brothers have to have a HUGE number of contacts all over the country. Contacts that will help him attract quality assistants and with recruiting high school players. I'm sure that his brothers would do anything they could to help him out since they don't compete against UK head to head at their current schools.

    The only downside is that he doesn't have head coaching experience. I don't think that's something that should automatically disqualify him or anyone, because every successful head coach had to start somewhere. The key is choosing the right one, of course. Mark is only 45 years old, which is pretty much the ideal age for a coordinator to make the move up, in my opinion.

    If he's willing to take the UK job, I think that alone would be a very good reason to hire him. I say that because I think Florida State, boosted by their 2011 & 2012 recruiting classes, is going to make serious runs at the national championship over the next couple of seasons. If they do, Stoops would become one of the hottest prospects in the country as a result. I'm sure that he's very excited about Florida State's immediate future, and I don't think he'd leave there for Kentucky unless he was extremely confident he would be successful here. We need a coach with that kind of confidence. Somebody who sees the difficulties here as nothing but extra motivation. If Stoops displays that kind of attitude we should hire him immediately. With the name Stoops and coming from Florida State I think he would energize even the most fickle fans.

    One interesting question would be if Mike Stoops would leave Oklahoma to come help Mark start his program, like Mark helped Mike start his at Arizona. As a new head coach Mark would certainly need Mike's help a lot more than Bob.

    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    If it's between Mark Stoops or Butch Jones?? That's a bit of a toss-up, but I think I'd prefer Jones.

    “People who live in the past are afraid to compete in the present. There's no future in it.” -- Sparky Anderson

  • So your arguement is that because his last name is Stoops we should hire him. Because other than that they have similiar careers. Stoops 11 years at a major school, Mac 10 years major school or NFL. Stoops defensive cord of the year, Mac was awarded assitant coach of the year at Duke. 45 perfect age to move up to head coach, which is also when Mac did it. The differance is Mac does not have the name but does have experince.

    If the last name is some a game changer then why is Bob the only one who is a head coach right now. I would think if name was that big of deal Mark would still be coaching for Mike at Arizona.

    They are a whole lot closer than you want to make it out to be. I can't say either would or would not have success
    I think Jones, Stoops, or Macintyre would all be great choices.

  • What gives stoops the SLIGHT advantage for me is that he can get us into homes of recruits that we've never had access too. He'd be like Charlie strong except WAY better in that regard.

    I also like the fact that he has COMPLETE control over the defense. Fisher runs the offense so in essence, Stoops has been the head coach of the defense.

    MacIntyre would be a hell of a hire but I think stoops is maybe a once in a lifetime type hire.

    Stoops is on the level of a Kirby Smart, Will Muschamp, Bob Stoops etc... type hire...
    I mean that in terms of "resume when hired". Doesn't mean he'll get us a national title really quickly like Bob or take us to the top five like Muschmap in year two, but the guy has all the "tools"...

    This post was edited by hoptownukfan 17 months ago

  • "Doesn't mean he'll get us a national title really quickly like Bob or take us to the top five like Muschmap in year two, but the guy has all the "tools"..."

    How about just a win over UL and 4 conference victories. I think most people's head's would explode if a coach could accomplish those things here at UK.

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  • My main argument is that MacIntyre's big jobs have been the DC at Duke and HC at SJSU. I don't think either of those jobs are very impressive, and they certainly aren't the type of previous jobs that are going to fire up the disgusted fanbase.

    Mark Stoops, on the other hand, comes from a string of jobs at what I consider "big" football schools (Miami, Arizona and Florida State). He's taken FSU's defense from one of the worst in the nation in 2009 to one of the absolute best these last two years. He quickly and dramatically improved FSU's defense and he's been able to sustain that improvement.

    STOOPS AS DC AT ARIZONA
    ----------------------------------------------------------------------
    Total Defense
    --------------------
    2003 ... #109
    --- Stoops Arrived ---
    2004 ... #61
    2005 ... #86
    2006 ... #49
    2007 ... #53
    2008 ... #24

    Scoring Defense
    -------------------------
    2003 ... #107
    -- Stoops Arrived ---
    2004 ... #55
    2005 ... #64
    2006 ... #35
    2007 ... #59
    2008 ... #33

    STOOPS AS DC AT FLORIDA STATE
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------
    Total Defense Ranking
    2009 .... #108
    --- Stoops Arrives ---
    2010 .... #42
    2011 .... #4
    2012 .... #2

    Scoring Defense Ranking
    2009 .... #94
    --- Stoops Arrives ---
    2010 .... #20
    2011 .... #4
    2012 .... #7

    ==========================================================

    MacIntyre did improve Duke's defense, and I'm sure that's a much harder job to do than what Stoops had at FSU. But, one of my big problems is that it doesn't appear that he was able to sustain it past that first year. The other problem I have is that MacIntyre has never seen what it takes to coach and mold a top ranked defense. Stoops not only has seen and heard how to do it, but he appears to have also learned how to mold one himself.

    MACINTYRE AS DC AT DUKE
    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    Total Defense Ranking
    2007 .... #92
    --- MacIntyre Arrives ---
    2008 .... #60
    2009 .... #61

    Scoring Defense Ranking
    2007 .... #98
    --- MacIntyre Arrives ---
    2008 .... #50
    2009 .... #83

    MacIntyre's 2009 Coordinator of the Year Award is a little bit puzzling to me. After I saw where his unit ranked nationally that season, it wasn't clear to me why he won the award. After I did a little research it doesn't appear that success on the field is the only thing used to determine the winner. It might not even be the most important aspect, at least not every year (see list below).
    It says on the AFCA website that ------- the criteria for the award is not limited to on-field coaching ability or the success of the team and players that these assistant coaches work with. Service to the community through charitable work and other volunteer activities, participation in AFCA activities and events, participation in other professional organizations and impact on student-athletes are all taken into account in the selection process. ------

    Here's what the AFCA website says about MacIntyre winning the 2009 award. I mainly noticed that it didn't say a single word about his defensive unit at Duke that season. The wording almost makes it seem like he received it as more of a lifetime achievement type of thing. You can judge for yourself -------------
    Mike MacIntyre, Defensive Coordinator, Duke: MacIntyre has been coaching football for 20 years, the last two at Duke ... He is involved with the Fellowship of Christian Athletes, serving in various capacities over the years at both the boys camp and coaches camp ... MacIntyre has also spoken at various FCA events, and at rallies for Students Standing Strong ... He ran and worked a kids summer camp while as an assistant coach with the Dallas Cowboys ... He is also a Deacon in his church ... Mentored such as athletes as Von Hutchings, who was a third string receiver at Mississippi until MacIntyre asked him to move to defensive back, where he started three seasons and still plays in the NFL ... MacIntyre helped former Ole Miss wide receiver L.J. Taylor get his start as a high school coach ... He engages his student-athletes with “life lessons” before each film study, and challenges each of them to implement those lessons in their daily lives ... His success as a coach includes coaching in five bowl games, two NFL playoff appearances with the Dallas Cowboys, and coached numerous All-Conference and Pro Bowl players. --------------

    RECENT AFCA ASSISTANT COACH OF THE YEAR AWARD WINNERS
    ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
    2006 ... John Chavis - Tennessee DC = #50 Total Defense
    2007 ... Calvin Magee - West Virginia OC = #15 Total Offense
    2008 ... Mac McWhorter - Texas O-Line Coach = #41 Rushing Off & #65 Sacks Allowed
    2009 ... Mike MacIntyre - Duke DC = #61 Total Defense
    2010 ... Luke Fickell - Ohio State DC = #4 Total Defense
    2011 ... Norm Parker - Iowa DC = #60 Total Defense
    2012 ... Kirby Smart - Alabama DC = #1 Total Defense

    Some of them seem to have won it for their unit's success on the field, some for their efforts in the community and off the field, and probably a little bit of both for all of them. I would describe it as a "Good Guy Award", because I don't think coaches like Bobby Petrino, Mike Leach, or Lane Kiffin could ever win this award no matter how good their unit's performed. Although, in an unbelievable case of irony, Jerry Sandusky did win the award in 1999, his last season as a coach.

    So maybe MacIntyre winning that award isn't as great of an accomplishment as it first seems, at least not in terms of great results on the football field.

    “People who live in the past are afraid to compete in the present. There's no future in it.” -- Sparky Anderson

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  • Wow, even some posts on a non-premium thread get blocked too. That's crossing the line into craziness, isn't it?

    How would I know if he was about to call me an asshole? lol

    “People who live in the past are afraid to compete in the present. There's no future in it.” -- Sparky Anderson