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Just sitting here listening to Trevor Matich talk about Kentucky football. He had some really good things to say.
-First off he said that next yr will be really tough to take.....and shouldn't be measured as much in wins/losses, but more in the strength of character of what our players display.
-He also said that Kentucky fans should be patient with Joker. He really feels that Joker is a good coach and will get us on the right track.....he just needs another yr or so.
-He felt that with what he had to work with last yr that Joker did an amazing job coaching to get us to 5 wins.....and he did a great job keeping his players motivated and bought in.
-He stated that if we develop an offensive playmaker we'd be much, much better off
-Doesn't believe that Joker is on a hot seat
-Believes that UK can become like South Carolina.....meaning that they can rise up to get 8+ wins a yr, but it would be tough.
The analyst Christian (last name?) noted:
-Next yr we'll be winless in SEC play, but they will recover from the next season. He describes next yr as a "reset" yr that UK will bouce back from.
-The talent is young and there is some promise there
-We need a playmaker
-We can get to 7-8 games consistently at UK
It was good to hear very good analysis from people who are objective to Kentucky and who make it their profession to analyze teams for a living.
Man, I hope we don't go winless in SEC play next year! Sorry, but I just dont see that happening.
I don't think they really provided much analysis. They looked at how bad our offense was last year and saw we lost Danny and Winston. That's honestly all the thought process they put into it. Winless in the SEC? Get real.
I think the most surprising comments came in what they thought of Joker and the future of Kentucky. Sure they didn't think much of next season (which even the biggest sunshine pumpers believe we won't be great next yr), but both analysts seem to think that given enough time Joker can win games at Kentucky. It's good to hear from people who are more objective than the posters on these boards.
You guys seem to be glossing over the part where they picked us to finish this year 3-9 (0-8), even saying we would have a tough game against Western F'n Kentucky. They basically snickered and made fun of us (despite trying, or at least giving us the facade of effort, to convince us they weren't laughing at us, and then at other times openly apologizing for laughing at us) for an entire segment, including laughing while putting L's in the column and offering no analysis as though there was nothing to say. That irks the shit out of me. They had to dig pretty deep to come up with some generic "compliments" to make, and half of them were about the GD basketball team... on ESPN coverage of SEC FOOTBALL MEDIA DAYS!!! Don't try and put make-up on that pig... JDrum spoke at length about it on twitter, so I'm far from the only person who noticed this.
I'm sick and damn tired of being a laughing stock for these analysts. I'm sick and damn tired of wearing my UK gear out to bars in the deep south to watch football games, and having bartenders laugh at me when I say "can you put one of the TV's on the Kentucky game" before saying no. I'm sick and damn tired of having our games relegated to comcast sports southwest or whatever joke of a channel they end up on. I'm sick and damn tired of having LSU or Bama or whoever else's fans telling me we embarrass the league and should move to the ACC.
I really hope Joker can get this job done because that is clearly what is in the best long-term interest of the program, and I have faith that he can, but I thought the days of counting UK as an automatic victory and being everyone's homecoming game were over. If we slip further backwards this year, Joker, for better or worse, is going to have to take the symbolic axe, and some tough decisions are gonna be in store for Mitch. I love our school more than anything, and to have to sit there and take that from people, and let's face it, a lot of it is true, miff's me to a point I can't explain.
Now, I've been holding that in since yesterday afternoon... It feels a lot better to get it out. I want Joker to succeed because he cares about UK just as much as I do, so for now, I'm behind him 100%. GO CATS.
There is way more riding on 2012 than you (and many others) are anticipating. A poor season and the termination of Joker Phillips will result in the following:
A coaching search with the very likely hire of someone far down most fans' "wish list"
A new philosophy/coaching style
A (probable) new offense
A (probable) new defense
Three years of recruiting classes who lost their recruiting, position, and head coaches
You think going 5-7 was bad? Or even a 3-5 win season in '12?
Wait until you see the floundering the program will experience if a new coaching staff with entirely new philosophies comes in with players that are not only at an athletic disadvantage (comparatively and generally speaking), but who are completely unsuited for the new schemes, have no familiarity with them, and who are potentially disillusioned with the firing of the men who recruited and coached them. Add this is a slavering and impatient fanbase who want instant results ("B-b-b-b-but Caaaaaaal did it with them freshmen!") and an administration that is (publicly) disinterested in promoting the program. Mix in a sprinkle of facility, bonding, and financial challenges and what do you get?
You and I and everyone else will be wishing that we were losing bowl games to Pittsburgh in Birmingham.
Which is not to say that the only option is keeping Phillips forever. Mainly to say that if the team is really that bad in 2012 and Phillips has to take "the symbolic axe" there won't be much of a silver lining at all.
You're absolutely right... and quite frankly, that's what I'm petrified of. I really hope that Joker can at least keep us competitive in all of our games (no 54-3 defeats) and win 5 games minimum. There is a lot of hope for the future, and for good reason in my opinion (especially considering the way we finished out last year), but we can't have the year that everyone who projects college football for a living thinks that we will. I'm confident Joker won't let that happen... but if he does... oh my were in for a long bumpy ride. It wouldn't be so frustrating and scary if we hadn't gotten that taste of being respectable within the conference. Now I'm just chasing the dragon until we get back.
I keep reading about better recruits and young talent. Now if joker gets fired our athletes are at an athletic disadvantage. Give me a break. If we're recruiting better football players we will get better. No matter what the scheme is. If we go 0-8 in conference like we're predicted to then jokers a bum and deserves to get fired. Franklin had no trouble turning things around in year 1. I believe urban Meyer won a championship in year 1. Sometimes change is a good thing. It brings excitement. Like the other Guy said I don't like UK being a laughing stock. This program should at the least be competitive and respected. I also think you'd be surprised at the coaches that would be interested in the job.
For the record I'm not saying jokers a bum or predicting 0-8. That's just going by the predictions. Now if he goes win less in conference play then as a coach he's a bum. All hypothetical at the moment.
Yet another example of an astounding lack of reading comprehension.
Franklin had no trouble turning what around? Going from 0 SEC wins to 2 SEC wins, including those marquee wins over a terrible UK and an even worse Ole Miss, while Vandy had three senior NFL draft picks on defense? That's a turnaround?
Your standards for Franklin are exceedingly low.
Back to your reading comprehension. You'll notice the last part of my post specifies that my post wasn't a "keep Phillips forever" post. It was an observation that 2012 may have much more at stake than just Phillips' job security.
My comment about the athleticism of the team, if you'll notice, specifically noted "comparatively and generally speaking." Meaning that we need to rely on kids becoming students of the system, executing at a very high level, and buying in 100% to the concept to beat a team with freak athletes lining up across from them.
While recruiting appears to be improving, it's foolishness to think we've reached the level of athlete where we can just plug another system in and win immediately.
I agree with the above posters. I don't think people really understand that if we fire joker, it would take a miracle to recover quick. I have all the faith in the world in joker and I don't want him fired. He's bringing in better talent by the day, he just needs the time to get everyone acclimated to his scheme and I swear you guys won't be disappointed. One thing being a UK football fan has taught me is that you gotta be patient. Everyone wanted rich brooks fired after we had a couple 2-10 3-9 seasons, but it took time and we improved. That's the phase joker is in now and I trust him and the staff on what they're doing.
I also agree that I cannot stand how UK is talked about on national tv. It seems like EVERY SINGLE DAMN HIGHLIGHT IS AGAINST US!! We understand football is in the shadow of basketball, and most likely it will be for a very very long time, but that doesn't mean we should be a laughing stock. We've had embarrassing games, but we've stood toe to toe with the heavyweights in the toughest freaking league in the nation, and no one seems to take that into account. We hardly got credit for our '07 team when we were ranked 7th and game day was there to play UF. It'll take time, but I've been faithful for all 19 years of my life and I'll continue to be. If you're wanting a team that's gonna win every year all the time, go jump on a bandwagon...but I can't wait to be a fan of THE UNIVERSITY OF KENTUCKY WILDCATS football team whenever they shock the nation in the future, and just sit back and smile. GO CATS
#BBN #WeAreUK #BoyleCountyAlum
I am not happy with the losing like everyone else, but Uk had one of the worst offense's in the nation last year and somehow won 5 games.
I think this season they have 3 games they will win but the games against:
Louisville - I game that will set the tone
Missouri - seen a bunch of them and they can be beat
Vandy - the day when vandy is a guaranteed loss........ Will be depressing
Tenn- have talent but something is missing there
Mississippi St - always a tough fought game and usually depends on who makes mistakes
Florida- If they cant play with them now, no telling when
are these games they should be in to win.
I loved hearing what warford was saying " Talk is Cheap " ....... No one is going to respect you or pay attention to you until you make them and the only way in doing that is getting it done on the field. I LOVE FOOTBALL SEASON. I LOVE MY WILDCATS ... KEEP WORKING
I think at least one reason we get made fun of is that they hate UK basketball, but can't really make fun of it. Football, on the other hand is a way to take pot shots at UK.
I too agree we will be in an even bigger world of hurt if Joker is canned, but not because the problem couldn't be fixed. I just have zero faith that Mitch would do what it takes to hire the right coach and get it turned around.
Nobody, save a few true crazies, wishes Joker to fail, but I really think he's gotta make some serious progress to keep his job. The truth is, this year should reveal the real Joker Phillips as HC. When your back is against the wall, champions perform, and others choke. This is Joker and UK's chance to prove they at least have the heart to become champions. The time is now.
I can tell you this much: most people in NOLA and along the gulf coast don't even know the SEC plays basketball. The few people who will even discuss it with me fall into one of two categories:
1.) They like UK basketball to the extent they know anything about it, because we're typically the only school that is any good at it from the SEC, and they want the SEC to be champions in every sport. Now, they do all seem to hate Calipari, but I think they want us to win just from a conference prestige point of view. or,
2.) They say we are a basketball school and should move to the ACC or Big East because we can't compete in the SEC's real sport and and somebody better could take our place (this makes me so mad i could strangle somebody).
I also had to cringe time and time again when the BBN was in town for the SECT and the F4 (as much as I loved seeing my stomping ground painted blue & white instead of LSU, Bama, or Ole Miss colors) when we would get taunted by fans from other schools and the reply was "well we beat yall in basketball." I know UK fans think that's a good comeback, and it is to fan bases that care about basketball.. but those fan bases aren't in the SEC, save maybe Vandy. They laugh at us when we say wait for basketball season, because that's about as relevant to them as field hockey season. Down here, it's football, football, baseball, spring football, and football. All that said, all my LSU buddies were very quick to give us props on our baseball team this year, which I appreciated coming from them.
Nonetheless, all of this becomes moot if Joker comes out and coaches his tail off. I hope he can make it happen!
Man, that is post of the year material right there. So true, and exactly what I try telling people, but you just put it so much better. +1
Let's chalk up 2012 as the "reset" button year for a whopping 3 wins. Going into 2013, Joker's 4th yr on the 5-year deal AND Joker will be recruiting for his final contract year....
my question: will Mitch need to extend Joker after a 3-win campaign to not create a lame duck coaching scenario?
It is never easy to pull up the stakes, unplug and move the tents to another camp. Divorce ain't easy.
As much as we are looking for improvement in our young players, I think Mitch will be evaluating this staff with a keen eye on improvement. If he sees what he likes, I would not be surprised to see Mitch extend Joker with a symbolic 2-yr contract with rip cord language prior to THIS season's kickoff. Avoid all of the hotseat, negative recruiting bullcrap now.
Additionally, IF Joker is not our NEO, it depends who the next coach is to determine the doomsday scenario you painted. If we landed a gold-standard dude with uber juice, we'd be sailing in no time.
Lots on Mitch's plate now that the potential cash windfall, stage and spotlight of SEC football has grown exponentially.
This post was edited by Kooky Kats 247 21 months ago
Urban Meyer had a TON of talent from the Ron Zook. He inheriented a team that was predicted to win it with Zook, but horribly underacheived. Franklin got lucky with a JUCO QB that is Aaron Rodger's brother. Vandy wasn't expected to do good, but they fought hard, which suprised teams early, also note that Tenn whooped their butts the week before we beat Tenn. The young talent is there, not for this year for future years, so if we don't win this year, it isn't because the talent isn't there. How can you guys live your lifes being constant negative. Man, i would always be depressed because i would have nothing to look foward to. This team will be better than last year, it might not show on the W's and L's, but it will be. Also, with a terrible O last year we put 17 on UL, we should have beat them last year, but we are going to be hungry this year. (in bart scott voice) CAN'T WAIT!!!
This year's team has a lot more potential than last year's did, but last year's team had some potential too, and frankly, they just failed miserably to getting close enough to achieve it. On defense we have a bit of depth and they're in the 2nd full season of Minter's tutelage. I think we're gonna be much better on "D" than anyone thinks.
On offense, everything hinges on whether the damn WR's will catch a stinkin' pass. A lot of you who saw them in the spring have said they'll be better at doing so, so I will roll with that opinion, as you've seen them & I have not. Max Smith is demonstrably better @ QB than Newton, from what I saw last season. The "O" line is young, but will have some experience, size, and a bit of depth to it, so in the end, barring mass injuries, I think we'll be okay there. But where we have to succeed is with the WR's catching the ball and making yards after a catch. That happens, and we're going to win some games this year, and probably a game or two that nobody gives us a chance in right now. But the damn WR's have to do their jobs, there's no other way around it. They have to start producing.
If they do not catch passes, run their routes correctly, or block downfield after a catch for each other, then we may not even win 5 games. They do perform well, I can see Kentucky winning 6 or 7 games.
Quit trying to back pedal. It plainly says athletic disadvantage. Make up your mind we're either recruiting better athletes or not. Sure we're not recruiting like bama but all I read about is recruiting and young talent. Vanderbilt was 2-10. the next year they're bowling that's a turn around. After this year UK might wanna have 2 sec wins if the 0-8 predictions comes true. To the Guy that said Tennessee whooped Vanderbilt that game went to overtime. They won but wouldn't call that a whooping. comparatively and generally speaking if you have the athletes you can run any scheme you want and they'll be good. like I said sometimes change is a good thing.
This post was edited by jeffries123 21 months ago
You lost me when you started trying to compare Florida and Kentucky's football programs. (And Meyer didn't win the title his first year. He won two more games and finished only one spot higher in the SEC East - 2nd - than Zook with a loaded roster).
This post was edited by Matt May 21 months ago
Not comparing Florida to KY at all. I'm just saying that you can find success with a different scheme. It doesn't always take a long time to reap the benefits of a coaching change. If you have the athletes you can win regardless of what kind of system you run. Lawdog is right as far as being in the SEC we will always be at an athletic disadvantage. Especially with Bama, Florida, Georgia, Lsu. etc.
I never back pedaled. I'm still not. I question your reading comprehension. Let me quote myself for you:
"...with players that are not only at an athletic disadvantage (comparatively and generally speaking)..."
Comparatively speaking meaning comparing our athletes (in general) to the SEC (in general). Generally speaking meaning that while we might have some guys who are as athletic as anyone, that is not the case across the board.
I don't need to make up my mind because I've never contradicted myself.
The only thing you said that I agree with is that "if you have the athletes you can run any scheme you want and they'll be good." It is my position that (in general and in comparison to the SEC) we do not have the athletes to run any scheme we want, and that changing schemes will be worse before it gets better.
Which is, again, not to say that we have to keep Phillips no matter what. If he goes winless in the SEC, he will be terminated and rightfully so. It just won't be the cause for celebration some are making it out to be.
Yeah...that's kinda EXACTLY what you did. You talked about possible change at KY then used Florida (which May set you straight on your incorrect statement) and then Gods other son (no...not Tebow) James Franklin. (in which J set you straight)
Urban Meyer took over FLORIDA....and not just Florida, but he most talented roster in college football that year as well as being on the cusp of incoming freshman Tim Tebow, who is probably the greatest college football player of our generation and for sure that I've ever seen. Tebow built the winner there...not Meyer. I will admit, Meyer would have succeeded without him but not nearly as much imo.
As for Jesus' brother Franklin...as mentioned, Vandy went from ZERO con wins to an amazing TWO con wins!!! How he wasn't coach of the year in all of pro or collegiate sports baffles me. His two wins...Ole Miss & UK (worst offense in college football last year) Honestly...where else could they go but up? I will admit that they did compete and play hard in nearly every game and should have won more games had hey been more disciplined. But doesn't disciplined football fall on the coach? When it comes to UK and Joker it does.
Vandy was the most penalized team in the SEC last year and one of the most in all of college football.
Ita funny actually...to many UK "fans" (fans being used very loosely) the upswing in recruiting means nothing without wins....yet those very same "fans" point to nothin other than Franklin's recent recruiting even tho its translated into 2 conf wins...same "fans" that are quick to point out our run of bowl games is a mirage because we only avg 2-3 conf wins.....just some things that make you go hmmmmm.
Now i actually like Franklin, and hw may very well be the next big thing in coaching but i am so beyond tired of the constant love affair with his nuts by so many. Why is he given the benefit of the doubt when some can't give the same benefit of the doubt to OUR OWN COACH?!?
Btw, only the very first part of that was directed at you Jeffries123. The rest just kinda morphed into a rant n ramble all in one...apologies
This, This, and more This!
Excellent post and I want to zero in on what I quoted. I have said as much in other threads to posters like Minter and gotten no response. I would like to hear some of you Franklin and Chawly nut huggers respond to this.
Not impresses by Charlie. Franklin took a 2 win program and in 1 year went to a bowl and is recruiting outrageously good. Completely turned the culture around. I'm impressed by that. Not comparing KY success to Florida. Just pointing out he took a completely different scheme and style and had success rather quickly. There's plenty of other examples of first year success without that kind of talent. Hudspeth(spelling? ) at Louisiana Lafayette comes to mind.
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