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Now c'mon guys. It was obvious when Spurrier took over at USC that he was changing things big time. He was bringing in top 15 recruiting classes. He struggled his 1st few seasons and many on this and other boards were saying "same ole south Carolina". Well, look at him and his program now. It can't happen over night. However, if a coaching staff brings in recruiting classes like Vandy is currently doing for 3 yrs in a row or so, the on field performance WILL change. It's just gonna take him time like it did with Spurrier.
Yes he has some nice committments (key word) right now but it's along way until Feb. 2. He really hasn't proved anything yet.
Actually Vandy's class was ranked 49 last year and UK's 52. If Franklin actually signs the committments he has for this class then it could end up a top 20 class. But it's along way until signing day. Vandy's next game against Northwestern will say a lot. That's a big test for his team and what they're about. IMO
To be fair, SCar didn't really look like world-beaters last night either.
Of course, SCar's talent level has improved greatly and the recruiting grounds are fertile, but I'm not willing to crown SCar the next big thing or a lasting power just yet.
A. Please show me a single publication who put their class in the top 20 last year. IN reality, it dodn't even outrank us by much if any.
Also... Vandy was just a year removed from a bowl game when caldwell took over two years ago.. Vandy was actually looking pretty good when caldwell took over. Granted, the team was awful under caldwell, they had just made their first bowl game in 25 years.
This post was edited by hoptownukfan 20 months ago
His class last year was basicaly identical to UK's in terms of rankings. His class last year also started out hot and a bunch of guys jumped ship at the last second. He hasn't signed a single guy yet this year.
Struggled his 1st few seasons? It took him 7 seasons to finally have a season where he lost less than 5 games. In fact, last year's 10-2 season came 13 years after they hired Lou Holtz. It took 2 HOF coaches and 13 seasons to finally have they type of season they thought would be the norm when they hired Holtz.
This post was edited by JDHoss 20 months ago
Not really. I'm sick of all this message board political corectness. I'm tired of a bunch of Yahoos assuming what I mean based on some debate they had with someone else months ago. If people are just gonna make assumptions, rather than read the post, then they are already predjudiced as to what they are expecting. I can't control that.
The problem with this site for a while now is that there are a bunch of legitimite topics that can no longer be discussed, simply because some used those topics to complain about Joker. Well screw them. I'm gonna say what I feel, and it's not my fault if people want to jump to conclusions.
It really is mind-blowing, but can be a testament to how hard it is to get quality talent at a non-traditional program. When arguably one of the best QB/Offensive minds the SEC has seen can't consistently get a quality QB on his roster then that is a rather blinding reminder of just because you get a "name" coach it doesn't necessarily mean the road to building a program up is going to be easy.
South Carolina, even on defense, didn't look great last night. Clowney was sucking wind in the 1st quarter. I expected much, much more from him consider Vandy's line isn't exactly stout. As I said before, it's really clear Lattimore isn't 100%. I think had Shaw not gone down with the stinger/bruise then they would've won be a couple TDs. But unless that kid learns to slide he won't last the season with the way he runs outside of the box.
They desperately miss a healthy Lattimore and playmakers like Alshon Jeffery at WR. More so then I thought they would.
Obvious the Cocks weren't up for this one and Vandy certainly was. You can't give too many props for someone who lost a close game at home. Color me unconvinced, and its losses like this that hurt you down the road. The guy gets way too much credit for discovering the wheel when his Dores haven't beaten a single team with a winning record yet. If close counts then UK football has been awesome for the last 50+ years. no W, NO GLORY !
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Cat, I think the problem is that you began your argument by stating something no-one has actually said.
I don't believe, and feel free to correct me, that anyone has ever ridiculed you or anyone else for saying that Franklin is a good coach, or for being impressed by him.
Franklin is doing impressive things, mainly on the administrative and recruiting fronts. There are upgrades in progress for the program and Vandy had a nice recruiting class in 2012. No problem in being impressed by those accomplishments, or for considering Franklin a coach with a bright future.
My problem, all along, has been that Franklin has been anointed (by some) as a coach who has "completely reversed" the fortunes of the Vanderbilt football program.
In reality, Franklin has not accomplished (yet) nearly what Bobby Johnson did for that program. Franklin played last year with the benefit of a lot of Johnson's players in key roles for the team (Hayward, Marve, Fugger, Jelesky, May, Stacy, Garnham, Krause, Matthews, Boyd) and is still benefiting from Johnson's recruiting in his 3rd year classes and above. In 2008 Vanderbilt won 4 games in the SEC and only lost three of four by less than 10 points.
Franklin is, as yet, something of a paper tiger. He has not beaten a team with a winning record. While he has had numerous close losses, Bobby Johnson accomplished the very same feat, and at times did it better, especially in 2008.
Hell, in 2007, Johnson and Vandy lost by 3 to #24 GA! They beat #8 SCar, lost to #25 UK by a TD, and lost to #19 Tenn by one point.
2006? Lost to #14 GA by 2 points, lost to #7 FL by 6 points, lost to Ole Miss by a TD, lost to Ark by 2 points, and lost to #25 Alabama by 3 points.
2005? Beat Arkansas, Ole Miss, and Tennessee. Lost to #15 FL in OT by a TD, and to SCar by a TD.
2004? Lost to a 10 win Tenn team by 5.
2003? Lost to a 10 win Ole Miss team by 3.
That's why I'm not convinced James Franklin has "reversed the fortunes" of Vanderbilt. Because Bobby Johnson accomplished exactly the same feat from 2003-2008, and even managed to keep the vast majority of games close in 2009, despite having a poor overall record.
James Franklin may be the next great coach in college football. For now, however exciting he may be, losing close games is not something that Vanderbilt recently discovered with Franklin.
True. I kept thinking we played Loserville first last year but we didn't. Either way the records are very similar.
This post was edited by tWhit 20 months ago
Terrific post full of facts.
Hahaha!! The funny thing about that post is you fail to apply that very same train of thought to your own program. What about our improved recruiting? What about the fact that the class Vandy actually brought in was similar to ours when you take away the players that didn't sign? In your quest to scour Franklin's ball sack for unexplored areas you have completely forgotten to apply the same logic to your own program. FAIL.
Working on it now.
Your team. All the time.
1. James Franklin is Joker Phillips. The only difference is UK didn't pay Joker close to 2 million to give up his HCIW title so they could hire a "big name coach". Also, if you believe what some of the folks around Maryland say Franklin wasn't popular with his players, the fans, the administration or the alumni/boosters. I had a Maryland grad/fan tell me the other day that he things Edsell sucks but he'd rather lose than have an "ass" like Franklin back at Maryland. TFWIW.
2. These are the EXACT same conversations people had about Bobby Johnson and Rich Brooks. Just change the names and dates. What's even funnier now is that Rich Brooks is the man and Joker Phillips has ruined everything in the eyes of some...which makes zero sense as Joker was as instrumental in Brooks' success as anyone. Rich Brooks almost resigned because the AD everybody loves to loathe forced him to get rid of Ron Hudson. Everybody forgets these things in a quest to make a point.
3. Vandy is even worse off than UK and always will be. I don't care if Bear Bryant crawls out of this grave and accepts the coaching job. That's a 6 win ceiling program in the SEC and always will be.
4. Vandy from what I have been told now employs two of the biggest a-holes in both b-ball and football.
This is exactly what I've been saying all summer long and that still doesn't change after this game.
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