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To All You Feel Good Football Fans.. Do You Remember

  • Brick wall, meet usa1000. He's been banging his head against you for about 3-4 hours now, so it's better you be introduced formally.

    Keep Calm & Stoops On..

  • usa1000 said... (original post)

    Generally speaking I agree. However some coaches and schemes definitely get more out of their players than others. For example, Texas has had a Top 5 recruiting class every year for the past 4 years. How has that worked out for them? Mac Brown has run into some hotshot coaches over there in the Big 12 that aren't going to sit back and try to play smash mouth football against a bunch of 6'3" 340 DT's and big LBers that can fly. The Big 12 has figured out to spread those guys out and use space. OU, OSU, KSU, and Mizzou all play a form of the spread and all have less talent than Texas (one could argue OU) and they all beat UT this year.

    It is great to have the best talent, but you better be able to coach and scheme it up also.

    It's the freakin' big 12 man. UK plays in the SEC. Trying to compare would be like trying to compare lions and pussycats.

    Keep Calm & Stoops On..

  • The assertion is that UK is trying to stubbornly run a rigid scheme that does not allow it to compensate for the talent deficit. That's not true. UK's pretty multiple in what they do. They've tried almost anything and everything short of the wishbone and the Stack-I this year. They just haven't had the ammo this year to run a strong offense of any kind. If they turn recruiting misses into hits, Joker Phillips, Randy Sanders, Tee Martin and Mike Summers will once again have one of the better offensive units in the league. They've proven that in the past. The key is recruiting.

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  • Jeff Drummond said... (original post)

    The assertion is that UK is trying to stubbornly run a rigid scheme that does not allow it to compensate for the talent deficit. That's not true. UK's pretty multiple in what they do. They've tried almost anything and everything short of the wishbone and the Stack-I this year. They just haven't had the ammo this year to run a strong offense of any kind. If they turn recruiting misses into hits, Joker Phillips, Randy Sanders, Tee Martin and Mike Summers will once again have one of the better offensive units in the league. They've proven that in the past. The key is recruiting.

    The attempt is greatly appreciated but logic is of little use in this discussion.

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  • Some people seem to think that beating a BAD Tennessee team bodes well for next year. I've got some news for you, it doesn't. Sure the streak is over, but, that doesn't do anything for next year.

  • _Mike_ said... (original post)

    It's the freakin' big 12 man. UK plays in the SEC. Trying to compare would be like trying to compare lions and pussycats.

    Ah... You make my point for me. Four Top 5 recruiting classes in a row in a conference weaker than the SEC yet UT lost double digit games in 2 years. You ask why? Mac got out schemed. It is always a combination of Jimmy and joes with x's and o's.

  • Jeff Drummond said... (original post)

    The assertion is that UK is trying to stubbornly run a rigid scheme that does not allow it to compensate for the talent deficit. That's not true. UK's pretty multiple in what they do. They've tried almost anything and everything short of the wishbone and the Stack-I this year. They just haven't had the ammo this year to run a strong offense of any kind. If they turn recruiting misses into hits, Joker Phillips, Randy Sanders, Tee Martin and Mike Summers will once again have one of the better offensive units in the league. They've proven that in the past. The key is recruiting.

    EXACTLY! There are a bevy of coaches that know how to implement offensive and defensive schemes. Doesn't make a difference without players. UK had none this season and even in past seasons only had a handful. If there is something to shake your head at it's this staffs apparent inability to bring in consistently good recruiting classes. And I could use a little more fire and moxy from the head coach but he says that's not him. Looking at next season I have a real hard time finding 6 wins next season. All that said, hats off to the staff for beating UT with a whole lotta style points.

  • I agree on the offense. But scheme was a huge part of our awful defense when steve brown was the coordinator. We had nfl starters all over our front 7 a few years back and we still couldn't stop the run.

  • KSt said... (original post)

    EXACTLY! There are a bevy of coaches that know how to implement offensive and defensive schemes. Doesn't make a difference without players. UK had none this season and even in past seasons only had a handful. If there is something to shake your head at it's this staffs apparent inability to bring in consistently good recruiting classes. And I could use a little more fire and moxy from the head coach but he says that's not him. Looking at next season I have a real hard time finding 6 wins next season. All that said, hats off to the staff for beating UT with a whole lotta style points.

    I disagree. I can see us winning all of our non-conference games. I can see possible wins in the sec vs. miss. state, mizzou, vandy, tennessee, uscjr and possibly south carolina at our place depending on how lattimore recovers.

    With an upgrade at db coach and at corner back our defense is a LOT better. Our offense should also be better. Maxwell smith could end up being one of the better qb's we've had at uk EVER. Big statement, I know. He's got a BEAUTIFUL release. Something that even Couch, Lorenzen, or Woodson never had. The kid likely has the strongest arm of those three too. Sanders is on recrod as saying Maxwell's arm is the strongest he's ever coached.

  • hoptownukfan said... (original post)

    I agree on the offense. But scheme was a huge part of our awful defense when steve brown was the coordinator. We had nfl starters all over our front 7 a few years back and we still couldn't stop the run.

    I don't think it was scheme as much as mentality, and stat-wise, you saw similar results. But there was definitely a different feel to the defense with the aggressiveness and willing to force the issue instead of stand back on their heels and let offenses dictate.

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  • _Mike_ said... (original post)

    It's the freakin' big 12 man. UK plays in the SEC. Trying to compare would be like trying to compare lions and pussycats.

    Last week on a national radio program, the host refered to the Big XII as a "7 on 7 league".....

  • ukblueforever said... (original post)

    Some people seem to think that beating a BAD Tennessee team bodes well for next year. I've got some news for you, it doesn't. Sure the streak is over, but, that doesn't do anything for next year.

    And many people who are downplaying the win over that BAD Tennessee team didn't give us a chance in hell of beating them. Their disappointment in our win is palpable...

  • Dead on JD. The people that are now saying it was a "bad" win were predicting we would be beaten soundly. Just a shame some dont have the integrity to say it was a good win. How many programs win any type of game when moving their WR to QB and he gets his first action in his very last game.

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    It smells like microwaved homeless people in here.

  • hoptownukfan said... (original post)

    I agree on the offense. But scheme was a huge part of our awful defense when steve brown was the coordinator. We had nfl starters all over our front 7 a few years back and we still couldn't stop the run.

    That's a good point. Whether it's scheme or coaching in general, that defense had too much talent to allow the numbers it did. Fortunately, Joker addressed that issue. I'm confident that Minter would field a much better defense with similar talent.

    Let's vote this down to -30. Come on, people.

  • Jeff Drummond said... (original post)

    I can't offer any more help to those who continually fail to recognize it's about players, not schemes.

    But doesn't that reflect negatively on the coaching staff as well? Saying the staff has the scheme to "compete" but not the players shows a glaring deficiency in the staff. You can't prop the staff up on one hand saying "we have the scheme to compete" and just ignore the fact that the staff has been unable to land/keep the players to actually RUN the system. People want to brag about how stellar the offense was in 2007, but the fact is we were STILL a 7-5 regular season team, with a losing SEC record, that gave up almost over 400 yards and 30 points a game...and a whopping 34.5 points per game in SEC play. That's not a recipe to build a winning program on, no matter how you slice it.

    Now, you can argue that now with a competent DC, UK should be able to both bolster its offense and build on a semi-solid defense. But, then you rely on recruiting, and there's another problem.

    You can't be the 11th-12th ranked recruiting class year in and year out in the SEC and think you can line up and play pro-style football with these teams. And, most likely, UK will be 13-14th ranked class this year. The point the people harping on Leach is that he runs an unconventional offense that teams don't see on a week-to-week basis. Main reason UK eeked out a win Saturday is they ran an unconventional offense that UT hadn't seen from UK all season...combined with the D playing out of their minds and UT's suck.

    I'm glad UK won Sat...and I would like to think Joker can be successful, but I'm not seeing anything that gives me hope for the future. But, after looking at the season as a whole, I'm not totally committed on tossing the baby out with the bathwater, either. Hopefully they can make some decent coaching changes, finish strong recruiting, and be ready to play better in 2012.

    Edge

  • Edge IMO we were on our way to climbing the "ladder after 06 and 07, then we had the AWFUL classes of 08 and 09. Outside of 3-4 players those classes are worthless. Something like 10 of 50 arent on the team any more. For whatever reason those classes were just misses. We could have continued to climb if those were better classes. I truly believe if we hit on some of those kids we would be sitting around 8-9 wins this season and look where that would have put us in the east. With a very legit shot. Those classes hurt us worse than most realize. I dont believe its ALL about players or ALL about scheme but you have to have talent in both areas. A scheme can hide a couple guys by putting them in position to make plays. Talent can overcome some lackluster schemes. If we get both together we get an O like 07 and a D like we havent seen in a long time.

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    It smells like microwaved homeless people in here.

  • golfnut51 said... (original post)

    I'm glad UK won Sat...and I would like to think Joker can be successful, but I'm not seeing anything that gives me hope for the future.

    Edge

    You don't see anything for two reasons.
    1.) You simply don't have the understanding to know what your looking at. Obvious by your posts.
    2.) You don't want to see it. Fans like you (although will NEVER admit it) don't want the program to succeed, so that you have something to hate and match whatever misery you already have. To constantly have something to bitch about. Its sad really.

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  • UK could improve in football - within reason - if the administration would just decide to make it a priority. But they choose not to. They choose to take the safe, incremental, inexpensive path to what would mean mediocrity in most other conferences. An inexpensive, unproven coach-in-waiting? Please. Like that ever leads to superior results. This strategy just keeps things as they are at best. Is that where we want to be? This administration acts as if they are more afraid of losing ground than gaining it. But, what the hey, the SEC checks keep rolling in keeping the powers-at-be content and secure.

    Meanwhile, the long-suffering football fan, and some media types, keep the faith. Always hoping for improvement. One day we'll have a season to remember. Not subsequent seasons, just one here and there. If we only do this...or change that...or get this player...just one lucky bounce of the ball we'll finally win 2 - 3 SEC games?

    The expectation level for UK football has been set low due to decades of futility. It will stay there until fans have had enough. Maybe a few more decades of SEC a$$ beatings will change things.

    Wait and see how long it takes UofL and UT to climb out of their hole. They are committed, will take bold steps, and It isn't a matter of if, but when. Will we still be down in our hole, looking up at the light others are enjoying?

  • Jeff Drummond said... (original post)

    I can't offer any more help to those who continually fail to recognize it's about players, not schemes.

    I submit to you the Urban Meyer affect. Many times schemes and coaches make a difference.

    Bowling Green;
    season before Meyer was 2-9
    1st season under Meyer was 8-3

    Utah:
    season before Meyer was 5-6
    1st season under Meyer was 10-2

    Florida:
    season before Meyer was 7-5
    1st season under Meyer was 9-3

    Ohio State:
    6-6 this year.
    ?? (I project 9 or more wins)

  • hoptownukfan said... (original post)

    I disagree. I can see us winning all of our non-conference games. I can see possible wins in the sec vs. miss. state, mizzou, vandy, tennessee, uscjr and possibly south carolina at our place depending on how lattimore recovers.

    With an upgrade at db coach and at corner back our defense is a LOT better. Our offense should also be better. Maxwell smith could end up being one of the better qb's we've had at uk EVER. Big statement, I know. He's got a BEAUTIFUL release. Something that even Couch, Lorenzen, or Woodson never had. The kid likely has the strongest arm of those three too. Sanders is on recrod as saying Maxwell's arm is the strongest he's ever coached.

    A lot can happen between now and August, but I do not see the Cats beating UofL next season. I see 3 noncons and finding 1-2 SEC wins. I am not sold yet on Max Smith. And I'm not sure the staff wont give Newton another shot at starting to begin the year. I see a step back at OT and generally on defense. There are no CBs on the roster that instill much confidence and the LBs have a lot of production to replace. There is nothing at WR that makes me think a big step will be taken there. Finally, UK will sorely miss Tydlacka. I am stuck on 4-5the wins tops next season.

  • tommy said... (original post)

    You don't see anything for two reasons. 1.) You simply don't have the understanding to know what your looking at. Obvious by your posts. 2.) You don't want to see it. Fans like you (although will NEVER admit it) don't want the program to succeed, so that you have something to hate and match whatever misery you already have. To constantly have something to bitch about. Its sad really.

    I saw a 5-7 Dumpster fire with the 118th ranked offense (out of 120) and a defense that gave up 377 yards a game. I saw a team that squeaked out a 3 point victory against probably the worst-fielded UT team in our lifetime (102 offense, and UK accumulated a pathetic 220 yards against a team that gave up an average of 340 a game). Our "best looking game" was against a TERRIBLE Ole Miss team (115 in Offense, 419 yards a game surrendered) that fired their coach the day after UK won. And then lost by 20 to Louisiana Tech. Not Louisiana State....Louisiana Tech.

    I saw what everyone else saw...a disappointment. Sooner you stop admiring yourself in the mirror and start looking at the product on the field, sooner you too will realize that this team and this staff has some REAL concerns to address.

    And, you'll notice once again, I backed up my posts with some data and facts. Maybe you should try using some of those in your arguments instead of thinking you're the beat-all end-all of sports understanding and knowledge. You remind me of an old saying my grandfather used to use..."I'd like to buy him for what he's worth, and sell him for what he THINKS he's worth."

    Edge

  • Warmother51 said... (original post)

    Edge IMO we were on our way to climbing the "ladder after 06 and 07, then we had the AWFUL classes of 08 and 09. Outside of 3-4 players those classes are worthless. Something like 10 of 50 arent on the team any more. For whatever reason those classes were just misses. We could have continued to climb if those were better classes. I truly believe if we hit on some of those kids we would be sitting around 8-9 wins this season and look where that would have put us in the east. With a very legit shot. Those classes hurt us worse than most realize. I dont believe its ALL about players or ALL about scheme but you have to have talent in both areas. A scheme can hide a couple guys by putting them in position to make plays. Talent can overcome some lackluster schemes. If we get both together we get an O like 07 and a D like we havent seen in a long time.

    And I agree with what you're saying...to an point. The fact remains that THIS staff recruited THESE players, for better or worse. If they were all hits, everyone would be patting Joker on the back for what a successful team he's coaching/recruiting. It only stands to reason that if they're NOT succeeding that he should be held accountable.

    I wish he were winning...or I wish I didn't care so much. **EDITED** ..there's not a fan that wants UK to field a winning FB program more than I do. I'm sick and tired of being the laughingstock of college football.

    Edge

    This post was edited by 7lives 3 years ago

  • Edgehollow2 and tommy

    Calm down. Both of you are close to making personal attacks.

    I am who I am, said he who is. 15,235

  • 7lives said... (original post)

    Edgehollow2 and tommy

    Calm down. Both of you are close to making personal attacks.

    Guilty as charged 7.
    Ill stick to attacking ridiculous posts and not ridiculous posters. (Ridiculous posters in general, not that I was insinuating anyone particular)

    These POSTS (ill refrain from sayin posters) are beyond old, tired , and just redundant.

    WE GET IT ALREADY!!!

    But if posts can be nothing more than negative toward a football program that many if us love unconditionally then we should be able to be just as negative toward them.

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