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Is it true Joker is going to use more of the spread Off???

  • Catmando said...

    I gotta say, when Whitlow does a planned run, he reminds me a bit of Cobb. He gets a step on the defense just the way CObb did for us, but he also has a better arm. I could really see him doing some great things here if he can bring his skill set to the next level.

    Lets just hope he has the heart and determination. If so he could be a UK great.

    tWhit

  • In theory every play should be a touchdown if run with confidence. The point is to find the Defenses weakness while doing what your offense does best either run or pass. Teams that can't get a play called and run in 40 seconds are poorly coached at any school

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    The meanest dog in Taiwan.

    mrhotdice

  • t75 said...

    It helps to have a passing attack if you want to run a lot of spread. We didn't have that until Smith came in and started putting some "touch" on the ball; then the lousy receivers started catching a few balls. With the QBs we'll have next season, and some additional receivers, I'm of the opinion our passing will be much improved. Now we can spread the field and run the ball. Since we won't have a super great RB, the passing game has to help the running game for some balanced offense.

    The biggest difference for our WR unit will be that they have an actual WR coach that knows what he is doing and how to coach them up. Tee was a fabulous recruiter but not so much a WR coach. Same thing with Joker, he was a great recruiter and OC but I never liked him as a WR coach. Sanders likewise is a good QB coach but not so much when it comes to being the playcaller as OC...

    I don't care what style offense we utilize as long as they produce points, excite the fanbase, and produce the most important W!

    signature image

    Stoopified!

    cobbycobb

  • If the OL struggles, we'll see Maxwell in the gun and more receivers in the formation. UK will be fairly pass-happy, like we saw in the spring game. Will it be a spread? Doubt it.

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    "Nothing great was ever achieved without enthusiasm." ~ Emerson

    alphacat93

  • Hogan_Ryan said...

    was a guy who committed to us before he even set foot on campus because of his relationship he built with Tee, and then stuck with us even after Tee left. I believe is a perfect fit for the Spread, Wildcat, whatever you wanna say. But when Cobb ran it it was a big part of the offense and keeping teams off balance because Cobb could throw it or pass it. Whitlow brings that ability IMO

    No, the biggest reason Cobb was so effective in the Wildcat was because he was already on the field as part of the base offense. We didnt have to sub him in, and then the D coaches in the press box notice that and start screaming to the sideline "trick play comming! trick play comming!". We could break formation and flip him with Hartline/Newton to where he was at QB and the QB was split out wide. The defense wouldnt normally be schemed to stop what was going to come next.

    Same exact thing could be said for Darren McFadden's sucess as a Wildcat QB.

    So everyone thinking Whitlow will play a big role next season, take a step back. Same kinds of speculation were said this time last year about Bookie Cobbins. And he is more likely to be used as Cobb was, if his academics are OK and he is part of the WR rotation.

    JHB4UK

  • alphacat93 said...

    If the OL struggles, we'll see Maxwell in the gun and more receivers in the formation. UK will be fairly pass-happy, like we saw in the spring game. Will it be a spread? Doubt it.

    +1

    Not QB, not RBs or WR...More than any personnel grouping reaction, I think the switch to the pass happy attack is to save our depleted depth on the Oline. You can't expect smashmouth cloud of dust offense with 3 inexperienced piglets up front.

    Have them stand up, push and expect the ball out of QBs hands in 2.5 seconds.

    Kooky Kats 247

  • Run the spread? What does that really mean? There is a plethera of offense out there that come under the heading of the spread. Some are predominately passing offense, others are predominately run offenses, and some are balanced. The only resemblence some have to each other is the the spread gaps along the offensive front.

    I personally prefer the Triple Shoot Option offense which is a combination of a spread option attack and a run and shoot passing attack which is a balanced spread attack.

    C1180

  • Direct quotes from Joker since the Spring Game have been.....

    "We want to run 80 plays a game and want around 46 to be passes".... this is actually 20 more plays than an offense would run on average so to get to 80 you have to play hurry up offense... with Joker saying that he wants around 46 to be passes that is close to 60%, which he's always wanted to be a 60-40 pass to run ratio offense....

    "To play the way we want to play we need 9 good receivers"... Joker only uses 3 WRs sometimes 4 WRs in a set so he's saying that he wants them to go 3 deep. If you want that many WRs then you are planning on passing the ball a lot.

    "We want to be a pass first offense to setup the run".... Joker made it no secret that he wants to pass to setup the run. If he wants to be this then he'll pass the ball more than 60% of the time.

    Its also been confirmed that none of the plays that we saw in the Spring game were new plays. They were all still apart of the playbook that we've had in place since Joker has been here. So if you look at that and the quotes that Joker has given then you would see that the offense will be the version of the offense that Andre Woodson ran but at a faster pace using no huddle. You can call that a spread if you want because all the spread does is spread out the defense and you attack the defense while they are spread out. But don't expect a Hal Mumme or Mike Leach type of spread offense.

    UKani

  • UKani said...

    Direct quotes from Joker since the Spring Game have been.....

    "We want to run 80 plays a game and want around 46 to be passes".... this is actually 20 more plays than an offense would run on average so to get to 80 you have to play hurry up offense... with Joker saying that he wants around 46 to be passes that is close to 60%, which he's always wanted to be a 60-40 pass to run ratio offense....

    "To play the way we want to play we need 9 good receivers"... Joker only uses 3 WRs sometimes 4 WRs in a set so he's saying that he wants them to go 3 deep. If you want that many WRs then you are planning on passing the ball a lot.

    "We want to be a pass first offense to setup the run".... Joker made it no secret that he wants to pass to setup the run. If he wants to be this then he'll pass the ball more than 60% of the time.

    Its also been confirmed that none of the plays that we saw in the Spring game were new plays. They were all still apart of the playbook that we've had in place since Joker has been here. So if you look at that and the quotes that Joker has given then you would see that the offense will be the version of the offense that Andre Woodson ran but at a faster pace using no huddle. You can call that a spread if you want because all the spread does is spread out the defense and you attack the defense while they are spread out. But don't expect a Hal Mumme or Mike Leach type of spread offense.

    Gotta get a upvote for you in here, UKani. Glad to see you've decided to join the right forum!

    JDHLaw11

  • UKani said...

    Direct quotes from Joker since the Spring Game have been.....

    "We want to run 80 plays a game and want around 46 to be passes".... this is actually 20 more plays than an offense would run on average so to get to 80 you have to play hurry up offense... with Joker saying that he wants around 46 to be passes that is close to 60%, which he's always wanted to be a 60-40 pass to run ratio offense....

    "To play the way we want to play we need 9 good receivers"... Joker only uses 3 WRs sometimes 4 WRs in a set so he's saying that he wants them to go 3 deep. If you want that many WRs then you are planning on passing the ball a lot.

    "We want to be a pass first offense to setup the run".... Joker made it no secret that he wants to pass to setup the run. If he wants to be this then he'll pass the ball more than 60% of the time.

    Its also been confirmed that none of the plays that we saw in the Spring game were new plays. They were all still apart of the playbook that we've had in place since Joker has been here. So if you look at that and the quotes that Joker has given then you would see that the offense will be the version of the offense that Andre Woodson ran but at a faster pace using no huddle. You can call that a spread if you want because all the spread does is spread out the defense and you attack the defense while they are spread out. But don't expect a Hal Mumme or Mike Leach type of spread offense.

    Great points. I, for one, am actually anxious to see our team this year.

    mjdotson

  • What they will do depends on what they see at the start of fall camp. The offense can really develop or struggle during the summer during workouts. I agree with those who feel that our offense will very likely be similar to what they have run in the past. Speeding up the offense is probably a sign of a more balanced and developed team. The slow down we have seen, especially last year, was an attempt to shorten the game and help the defense.

    zcats

  • cobbycobb said...

    The biggest difference for our WR unit will be that they have an actual WR coach that knows what he is doing and how to coach them up. Tee was a fabulous recruiter but not so much a WR coach. Same thing with Joker, he was a great recruiter and OC but I never liked him as a WR coach. Sanders likewise is a good QB coach but not so much when it comes to being the playcaller as OC...

    I don't care what style offense we utilize as long as they produce points, excite the fanbase, and produce the most important W!

    Awful post.

    Tee wasn't the best WR coach but he was ok. Joker on the other hand remained WR coach when he was OC. We have had more wr success under joker than perhaps any other position on offense. Consider that had Lyons not gotten hurt he would have probably gotten a shot in the nfl, Burton played with the rams for two years and Stevie JOhnson is a Pro Bowl caliber players. Jacob Tamme will also likely take a big jump with the broncos this year.

    hoptownukfan

  • Love for us to run our same plays/schemes, but in a no-huddle hurry up pace.

    Maxwell Smith is still a young inexperienced QB, so there is no need ANYWAY to expect him to know this offense so well he comes under center with 3 plays, and ready to audible to what he sees after reading the defense. Give him a play and snap the ball in 10-15 seconds, no waiting around all 40 seconds on the playclock trying to figure out what the defense is doing and get a play called that might best work against it. Lets US be on the attack and dictating the pace.

    JHB4UK

  • hoptownukfan said...

    The "spread" is an over used term to describe offenses.

    Just because you line up in the shot gun doesn't mean you are a "spread" team. Just because you line up under center it doesn't mean you are a smash mouth team. Consider that Spurrier refused to use the shotgun for the first half of his tenure at florida.

    We won't be a "spread" team. We are a "pro-style" team in our truest sense. Joker and Randy prefer the pro-style offense that we saw in Hartline's senior year and the Woodson years. Our staff now thinks that we have the qb's in smith and towles and the receivers to return to this offense. Considering that our most successful season were in the pro-style offense we should be excited.

    We won't be a 4-wide offense. We haven't been under joker/sanders.

    I know the difference that's why I said zone-read and dink and dunk are two very different things. The spread is a formation and at the same time a philosophy-you execute what your guys can do out of certain formations. Most the time it's a 3 or 4 wr set with the qb in the gun that can be ran with a drop back passer or a dual threat (zone read type like our wild-cat package). Teams that run the spread with 4 wr's is just what they prefer, there are still spread team that use a TE and some even use a TE and a H-back on alot of plays like UofL did against us or like Auburn does at times. Remember how UofL kept killing us off-tackle to the weak-side last year? They were using a TE and a H-Back on some of those plays. The play they used asked for a last second shift that placed a TE and H-back on the weak-side (we couldn't get adjusted quick enough, I was livid) and they simply ran out-side zone behind a TE and H-back to the weak-side of our defense (and they numbers) so the play worked well...

    The point I was making is I like the thought of us using the gun with a athletic QB (when PT matures and is ready) because it will allow us to be a zone read (wild-cat) team while also being able to execute the dink and dunk off. It makes us multiple, it allows for great play-action but it's a quick hitting play-action, in return will help our O-lineman... Just imagine if Hartline had PT size and athleticism... Hartline had good speed but he wasn't the athlete PT is. Just imagine the stress this type of Off could place on the defense, it adds a extra dimention, it makes the defense have to prepare for extra schemes... If the D tries to run a simple Nickel Package (6 men in the box) we could absoluetly kill them with the zone-read (wild-cat), if they stay in Nickel and bring 7 or 8 men in the box we could use motion (sometimes man or zone cov is given away by defensive allignment) to get our key on man/zone coverage which would allow us to call our zone/man route beaters, "dink and dunk"... Just think about how tough this could be to stop. Almost no good zone read qb's have the Passing mentality like PT will develop with Randy and on the other hand almost no good dink and dunk qb's have the athleticism PT has. This type of Off would fit his skill set to a T all he needs is a supporting cast... GO CATS!!!

    todd

  • todd said...

    I know the difference that's why I said zone-read and dink and dunk are two very different things. The spread is a formation and at the same time a philosophy-you execute what your guys can do out of certain formations. Most the time it's a 3 or 4 wr set with the qb in the gun that can be ran with a drop back passer or a dual threat (zone read type like our wild-cat package). Teams that run the spread with 4 wr's is just what they prefer, there are still spread team that use a TE and some even use a TE and a H-back on alot of plays like UofL did against us or like Auburn does at times. Remember how UofL kept killing us off-tackle to the weak-side last year? They were using a TE and a H-Back on some of those plays. The play they used asked for a last second shift that placed a TE and H-back on the weak-side (we couldn't get adjusted quick enough, I was livid) and they simply ran out-side zone behind a TE and H-back to the weak-side of our defense (and they numbers) so the play worked well...

    The point I was making is I like the thought of us using the gun with a athletic QB (when PT matures and is ready) because it will allow us to be a zone read (wild-cat) team while also being able to execute the dink and dunk off. It makes us multiple, it allows for great play-action but it's a quick hitting play-action, in return will help our O-lineman... Just imagine if Hartline had PT size and athleticism... Hartline had good speed but he wasn't the athlete PT is. Just imagine the stress this type of Off could place on the defense, it adds a extra dimention, it makes the defense have to prepare for extra schemes... If the D tries to run a simple Nickel Package (6 men in the box) we could absoluetly kill them with the zone-read (wild-cat), if they stay in Nickel and bring 7 or 8 men in the box we could use motion (sometimes man or zone cov is given away by defensive allignment) to get our key on man/zone coverage which would allow us to call our zone/man route beaters, "dink and dunk"... Just think about how tough this could be to stop. Almost no good zone read qb's have the Passing mentality like PT will develop with Randy and on the other hand almost no good dink and dunk qb's have the athleticism PT has. This type of Off would fit his skill set to a T all he needs is a supporting cast... GO CATS!!!

    What you describe is a lot like the Triple Shoot Option offense and IMO that offense would be perfect for Towles skill set.

    Call it what you want when ever the offense can make the defense honor both the run and the pass they are way ahead of the game.

    C1180

  • rgunslinger said...

    I'm just excited to see this year's team take the field... Seeing all the people clad in blue making their way to the stadium The smells of steaks, burgers, and hotdogs on the grill Everybody is so friendly, you just walk by someone's tailgate and they're offering you food Walking thru the concourse and the excitement kicks up a notch Coming up the steps into the stadium and you get that first look at the field The music is blaring, the guys are out warming up The PA guy comes over the speakers telling you how long to game time....

    Man...it can't get here soon enough!

    113 days and 23 and one-half hours OR 2735 and one-half hours until the new season starts. But, who's counting ?

    wildcatharry

  • C i've never heard of that style of OFF but I believe you, if we move the chains you can call it whatever you want IDC... One thing is certain, people can not handle another OFF like last years, I think the teams on probation had better O's, but anyways I do not want to talk about that... Like UKani (sorry if I messed your name up, not on purpose) said being able to run the "wild-cat" "zone-read" along with normal Shotgun plays without having to sub is a killer, getting 80 plays off a game is great too, that means you are getting first downs... I just like the fact that PT will allow us to be versatile, I know he's not Vick but he is way more athletic than Morgan or even Hartline and Hartline was pretty quick.

    I've been a fan of the hurry up for ever, anything to make it harder on the other team, i'm for it. I just hope after the ball is kicked off and we line up on O or D, we look like a SEC football team. I hope this team works very hard and are ready. Last year we got pushed around by almost every team we played because of the simple fact that our Defense played 80 snaps a game even against Pro-Style "I" teams, plus we had a freaky amount of injuries... Our Offense has to produce something this year. Jacob Russel is a athletic kid too, we have options. Heck IDC if we have to run the Triple Option as long as we can move the chains and get in the end-zone. I think the triple option would make us competitive, it allows teams to compete with less talent. Did anyone see what happened BAMA last year when they played GA southern??? It was a game for a while... GA tech are also pretty good, in a conf that recruits pretty well. Anyways you can see that IDC what we do as long as we can produce some pointsn and get some W's...

    I also really hope Clemons and Collins can get back to normal. If they were 300# DT's they probably wouldn't be but as 200#ers they should be ready especially D. Collins... I hope more than anything Clemons has the same speed he had before. It really sucks that we lost a fresh RB last year that IMO had more potential than any RB I can remember since TOOOOSE... I also do not believe Joker and Randy will keep things around 46 pass plays out of 80 if they really have a passing game that works, in the past like with Hartline we threw it 40-45 out of 60-65 plays... But like I said IDC as long as we can move the chains... Sorry for typos my laptop is acting stupid right now...

    todd


  • TODD: Google Triple Shoot Option I believe you will find it very informative. Strange that you mentioned Ga Southern because Coach Matasukis the Guru of the Triple Shoot Option attack list the Ga Southern offense as one of sources for his offense which is a combination of run option and run and shoot. I said it sounded simular to what you were talking about because the it starts with an in motion WB either getting the ball or being faked the ball in the jet sweep by one of the two WBs and they use a lot of dink and dunk passing.

    C1180

  • suncat05 said...

    Yeah, that what Tubby always said....................

    I didn't know Tubby coached football? :)

    UKlaw82

  • mrhotdice said...

    In theory every play should be a touchdown if run with confidence. The point is to find the Defenses weakness while doing what your offense does best either run or pass. Teams that can't get a play called and run in 40 seconds are poorly coached at any school

    Don't you think execution has something to do with that theory? Confidence is great but can it catch a pass 40 yards down field without execution?

    UKlaw82

  • I do know this, to run the pro style O in the SEC you must have talent. UK does not have the over all talent in my op to do this. UK must run its offense to match the talent it has. To me it must open it up and throw alot of short in's and out's like UK did with D Abney and then try to shoot for a long pass when the safeties and the LB are drawn in. Plus it must throw a ton of screan passes to its TE to keep the pressure off of the QB like they did to J Tam. Then run it when they think you will throw it.
    Keep them guessing what you will run. UK has to change or it will be ugly again.
    Just one man's thoughts.

    This post was edited by dvillepro1 on 5/12/2012 at 1:26 AM

    dvillepro1

  • dvillepro1 said...

    I do know this, to run the pro style O in the SEC you must have talent. UK does not have the over all talent in my op to do this. UK must run its offense to match the talent it has. To me it must open it up and throw alot of short in's and out's like UK did with D Abney and then try to shoot for a long pass when the safeties and the LB are drawn in. Plus it must throw a ton of screan passes to its TE to keep the pressure off of the QB like they did to J Tam. Then run it when they think you will throw it. Keep them guessing what you will run. UK has to change or it will be ugly again. Just one man's thoughts.

    You have to have talent to run any scheme and be successful. lol. And the things you mentioned are the exact kinda scheme/plays we've had success with in the past.

    tWhit

  • You are right it takes talent to do anything but any balanced system will give you a advantage over any system that is extreme one way... I really like the run first spread systems, that new off the "triple shoot" that C keeps talking about is pretty cool. I don't ever see Joker using a system that is balanced, they will always use a pass first system if possible. Hopefully Sweat and Legree are everything we need em to be. We need our freshman WR's and OT's to be everything said to be and more.

    todd

  • I like lining up and running the play quickly, but let us remember, you must have an O-lIne that can knock people off the ball to keep the defense honest to be able to do that. Can our line blow open holes to be able to run on 3rd and 4 sometimes , or do you become so predictable that the defense knows what you are going to do no matter how you set the play. I have a hunch that if this O-Line poduces this year , UK will have a lot of success. As a matter of fact, anytime any team has a good O-Line, they will have a good season if they any skilled players with at least some talent. Blocking , tackling and staying positive in the turnover ratio usually breeds all the success in the world.

    Oldcarlcat

  • Rupp@TheBear said...

    I like lining up and running the play quickly, but let us remember, you must have an O-lIne that can knock people off the ball to keep the defense honest to be able to do that. Can our line blow open holes to be able to run on 3rd and 4 sometimes , or do you become so predictable that the defense knows what you are going to do no matter how you set the play. I have a hunch that if this O-Line poduces this year , UK will have a lot of success. As a matter of fact, anytime any team has a good O-Line, they will have a good season if they any skilled players with at least some talent. Blocking , tackling and staying positive in the turnover ratio usually breeds all the success in the world.

    You are so right... Hopefully Joker can prove to have a fundamentally sound team this year. He should this is his third go around...

    todd

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