Online Now 347

The House of Blue

The home for all discussion on UK athletics

On this Board 165
Record: 3046 (4/11/2012)

Online now 326
Record: 6210 (3/13/2012)

Boards ▾

The House of Blue

The home for all discussion on UK athletics

The Paddock

The place to discuss general topics outside of Kentucky

UK Ticket Exchange

Buy, sell or swap tickets

Reply

Joker and the future

  • I've heard a lot of people talk about the $300K recruiting budget and how we spent more for BBM. But I've not seen that recruiting number written and I don't get the opportunity to hear local talk to know how credible that is. But I do know Larry Vaught apparently wrote the report linked on this thread and I'd say his credibility should be golden. I'd imagine if he wrote it Joker said it.
    But it's apples and oranges really. Les Miles can walk out to get his paper in the morning and come back with a 5 star in Louisiana. Joker and the staff really have to travel harder than anyone else in the SEC to accomplish anything, and that's to shoot for 3 and the occasional 4 star guy.

    BenSam

  • BenSam said...

    I've heard a lot of people talk about the $300K recruiting budget and how we spent more for BBM. But I've not seen that recruiting number written and I don't get the opportunity to hear local talk to know how credible that is. But I do know Larry Vaught apparently wrote the report linked on this thread and I'd say his credibility should be golden. I'd imagine if he wrote it Joker said it.
    But it's apples and oranges really. Les Miles can walk out to get his paper in the morning and come back with a 5 star in Louisiana. Joker and the staff really have to travel harder than anyone else in the SEC to accomplish anything, and that's to shoot for 3 and the occasional 4 star guy.

    Tennessee travels more than UK ever will in football recruiting, the spend 1 million dollars each year. That is why UT gets recruits from all over the nation each year also.

    jehamm0

  • footballcat65 said...

    See Link. Joker has unlimited recruiting budget.

    If this is true (not saying it's not) Then why on God's green earth would we only spend in the 300's?
    If true that is by far the craziest thing I've read in along time, that has to be the 2 worse HCing decision Joker has made hands down.

    1- not spending all he could to turn over everyrock in the states looking for big time kids

    probably even worse

    2- Being able to and telling someone you could have because you have unlimited recourses and didnt use even enought to put urself in a better situation

    This post was edited by catfaninMs on 10/21/2012 at 10:36 PM

    catfaninMs

  • BenSam said...

    I've heard a lot of people talk about the $300K recruiting budget and how we spent more for BBM. But I've not seen that recruiting number written and I don't get the opportunity to hear local talk to know how credible that is. But I do know Larry Vaught apparently wrote the report linked on this thread and I'd say his credibility should be golden. I'd imagine if he wrote it Joker said it. But it's apples and oranges really. Les Miles can walk out to get his paper in the morning and come back with a 5 star in Louisiana. Joker and the staff really have to travel harder than anyone else in the SEC to accomplish anything, and that's to shoot for 3 and the occasional 4 star guy.

    I was not disagreeing with what Vaught was told. I find it hard to believe Joker with what he said. Not saying he didnt say it. But I find it hard to believe that it is true. If that is true, he needs to coach in the OVC not the SEC. We are a small fish in a big pond and those who cant sell their name and history need to spend more looking, which clearly...we do not.

    JCHS02

  • JCHS02 said...

    I was not disagreeing with what Vaught was told. I find it hard to believe Joker with what he said. Not saying he didnt say it. But I find it hard to believe that it is true. If that is true, he needs to coach in the OVC not the SEC. We are a small fish in a big pond and those who cant sell their name and history need to spend more looking, which clearly...we do not.

    Now that makes perfect sense to me. If he has the option to spend but isn't then he isn't trying. Both sides of this particular argument may be right. He can spend what he wants as he told Vaught but they recruit the picked over areas in the south that are a bus ride away. So maybe the amount is around 300K.
    Someone ought to sneak a call into his show and ask him on air.

    BenSam

  • JCHS02 said...

    This team is the most up and down team I have ever seen.

    Not to nitpick your post, as I think I agree with the overall tone (it's quite long), but how is this team "up"?

    BlueGhost

  • BlueGhost said...

    Not to nitpick your post, as I think I agree with the overall tone (it's quite long), but how is this team "up"?

    I was referencing young players being up and down. Like during games they have their moments and then others they do not look like the same player. Or even in practice for that matter. Trust me, I dont see much of 1-7 being "up".

    JCHS02

  • JCHS02 said...

    OMG!!!! You are so right! My mistake..if Joker said it while under contract with UK...it MUST be right. Just like Obama is for coal and Clinton didnt have sexual relations with that woman. I can always tell you are the type to believe everything you hear. So this post really didnt concern you. For what its worth, you have the wrong horse. If Joker had unlimited spending, Im fairly certain he would be spending more than what we did at Madness. Its like asking a kid what he wants for Christmas. If he says he wants a Porsche, Im guessing hes not getting one of those even though you told him if he was good hed get what he asked for.

    First of all I have no reason to think Joker or Vaught would lie. Have they lied to you? Secondly why bring a political agenda into a football discussion. Lastly if you would have even read the article you might have seen where they spent 500,000 on airline tickets and official visits last year. You would also seen it wasn't their philosophy to recruit nationally. Also said they never asked for something and not gotten it.

    So we shouldn't believe a respected journalist and a the head football coach but are supposed to believe you? fail

    footballcat65

  • JCHS02 said...

    I was referencing young players being up and down. Like during games they have their moments and then others they do not look like the same player. Or even in practice for that matter. Trust me, I dont see much of 1-7 being "up".

    Oh, I get you. You're right. There is a serious lack of emotion sonetimes.

    BlueGhost

  • TheProfessor said...

    Changing coaches for the sake of changing coaches seems futile to me. Until there is a strong institutional commitment to the football program, the revolving door of head coaches will not be sufficient to move this program to any other level, and keep it there.

    I kinda agree, but it depends what HC you land.

    If they hire a Petrino or Parcells, you can bet de facto changes in admin will be made. But if they hire such a guy, they already created and accept a paradigm shift.

    When they hire a coordinator from somewhere or a retread blah blah, your words couldn't ring more true...

    Kooky Kats 247

  • footballcat65 said...

    First of all I have no reason to think Joker or Vaught would lie. Have they lied to you? Secondly why bring a political agenda into a football discussion. Lastly if you would have even read the article you might have seen where they spent 500,000 on airline tickets and official visits last year. You would also seen it wasn't their philosophy to recruit nationally. Also said they never asked for something and not gotten it.

    So we shouldn't believe a respected journalist and a the head football coach but are supposed to believe you?

    A political agenda? I literally laughed out loud. You sir, need to grow up. Its called a metaphor. For what its worth. But the rest of your post isn't worth the time to reply to. Next?

    JCHS02

  • JCHS02 said...

    A political agenda? I literally laughed out loud. You sir, need to grow up. Its called a metaphor. For what its worth. But the rest of your post isn't worth the time to reply to. Next?

    Yep, you can always tell when someone knows they're wrong. They want to take their ball and run home to mommy.coffee

    footballcat65

  • shepp2700 said...

    Most people said he could get by with 3-9, maybe... And that was not thinking there would be lots of injuries. All the losses, and so many who already hated him have made it tuff to keep things in perspective. The wky loss did hurt, but only by 1 in OT, so not the end of the world. But, I think that 4-8 is the only way he would feel safe. But, I still think he's back with a 3-9 record bc the team was so young and beat up, and talented! But, like Trenton has said all along, I don't think we will have all of his staff back. I just hope we take the game last night against a top 10 team, and progress the last 4, run the damn table!!! Not likely, but do people know that UK is actually still bowl eligible at 5-7 based on a new rule this year lol? I posted the espn article about the rule change early in the season, just sayin. Go big blue!!!

    Losing to Western is unacceptable. Period. We also had our starting QB for that game and he threw 4 INTs. I don't see how Max Smith (while a decent QB) would have won a single game that we have lost if he had been in. Would he have beaten USCjr, Arky, UGA, MSU, Florida?

    We have injuries, yes. But to say that having ANY of those players back would have won us any of the games we lost this year is absurd. We lost to WKU and UL while fully healthy. People always yap about injuries, then completely ignore that we were healthy while we lost to a Sun Belt and Big East team. And we didn't just lose to UL, we got stomped. Let me repeat, we got stomped by a team that has almost lost to UNC, USF, FIU, and Southern Miss. What makes anyone think a team that lost to those 2 could have beaten any of the other teams on our schedule?

    We will beat Samford and that is it. That is being a realist, not a pessimist.

    TransyCat09

  • JCHS02 said...

    This team is the most up and down team I have ever seen. But guess what? They are freshman and sophomores. Pretty sure that is the calling card for young talent in college football, they are up and down. More often than not you see the upside progress and the downside go away with experience which they are gaining this year. We are about to enter into an offseason where there will be several coaching changes and one where we might not be the beneficiary of something as great as maybe after next season with the competition among BCS teams. With a tough schedule next year would it be wise to bring him back one more year? If the team responds to him the rest of this year and we win 3 of the final 4 games, does he deserve another shot? No coach could take this team and do much with them considering their youth. If you are on that bandwagon from before this year that begged for him to get fired then I would assume your answer would be to still get rid of him. But honestly, how can anyone make a decision on Joker based on this year full of injuries? I would love to see a Joker Phillips with 1.5 million for recruiting and not 300k. From my count, that would be 1.2 million more in spending, not the 2.55 it would cost to fire him. Just a thought, but maybe they should spend more money on the program and not just on a new coach. No coach is going to be successful in the SEC with 300k in recruiting dollars. Just isnt going to happen, not in KY.

    You make some excellent points JCHS. I dont care if your the 2nd coming of Bear Bryant..if you dont have the dollars and support..your not going to succeed on college football's grandest stage..the SEC.

    BigBlueDawg12

  • What was last year? How injured were we last year?

    How injured were we when we lost to WKU and UL?

    TransyCat09

  • As for the recruiting budgets, don't let those numbers fool ya.

    Feel free to hit up some of the national boards, team boards, or whatever you choose and talk to some of the other fans about the recruiting budgets.

    This was recently a hot topic on one of the national boards on a site, member board also. Like most schools it all depends on how they report expenses, many schools do it differently.

    LSU, USCjr, and many of those schools spend more than 1 mil on recruiting, according to their fan bases, who clearly explained how and why it is reported as such a low number.

    If Joker isn't spending what he can on recruiting and trying to land better players, then that is his own fault.

    And no Les Miles can't just walk about and get a 5 star in Louisiana, there isn't even a 5 star player in Louisiana this year according to most sites. Now obviously, they have much better HS talent than KY, and it is not comparable, but to act like these big time SEC programs aren't dropping tons of cash flying players around and treating them like royalty is naive.

    Maybe UK spends more than listed in that one article, and it is just reported differently.

    BigBlue1202964

  • We were undefeated and unscored upon before Max "The Snake" Smith had his terrible injury. No doubt we would be headed for back to back showdowns with Bama if not for that tragic misfortune. It takes the keen eye of the OP and people like Kyle Tucker to see the real genius and potential of this football team and staff...

    DACats86

  • Wow..guys..the hostility and overall lack of football knowledge amazes me here! OK..we are where were at..but if you know even a tad about football you can see this Uk team has some talent..its just mostly freshmen and sophs.. We would have at least 3 or 4 wins had Max Smith not went down..

    BigBlueDawg12

  • BigBlue#1 said...

    As for the recruiting budgets, don't let those numbers fool ya.

    Feel free to hit up some of the national boards, team boards, or whatever you choose and talk to some of the other fans about the recruiting budgets.

    This was recently a hot topic on one of the national boards on a site, member board also. Like most schools it all depends on how they report expenses, many schools do it differently.

    LSU, USCjr, and many of those schools spend more than 1 mil on recruiting, according to their fan bases, who clearly explained how and why it is reported as such a low number.

    If Joker isn't spending what he can on recruiting and trying to land better players, then that is his own fault.

    And no Les Miles can't just walk about and get a 5 star in Louisiana, there isn't even a 5 star player in Louisiana this year according to most sites. Now obviously, they have much better HS talent than KY, and it is not comparable, but to act like these big time SEC programs aren't dropping tons of cash flying players around and treating them like royalty is naive.

    Maybe UK spends more than listed in that one article, and it is just reported differently.

    UK probably spends less than what is listed if they spend anything. I highly doubt its more. Id say on the basketball end of it is like what you are saying, but football, Id say 300k is about right. LSU can teams of their stature can sell their name and their recent success and their fan base etc. We cant sell any of that. Until they put money into it, nothing will change. Money into a coach, money into recruiting, money into facilities, and so on and so forth. We are nothing but a small kid trying to hang with the big boys right now.

    JCHS02

  • BigBlueDawg12 said...

    Wow..guys..the hostility and overall lack of football knowledge amazes me here! OK..we are where were at..but if you know even a tad about football you can see this Uk team has some talent..its just mostly freshmen and sophs.. We would have at least 3 or 4 wins had Max Smith not went down..

    So we have no football knowledge, but you think the guy that lost to UL and WKU could have beaten 2-3 out of USCjr, UF, MSU, UGA, and Arky?

    Look, I like Max and think he is a good QB. But whatever the reasons for our disastrous season, Max Smith isn't going to change that. As has been mentioned, he was the QB when we lost to WKU and UL. Those losses were not exclusively his fault, but he obviously wasn't enough of a factor for us to win.

    Now all of the sudden people start making excuses and say the same person that lost to WKU would have somehow single handedly been responsible for beating 2 top 20 teams.

    But what do I know, I have no football knowledge. no

    TransyCat09

Kentucky
247Sports
Features
Resources
Connect

247Sports In partnership with CBS Sports