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Democrat Convention

  • dj-ky-cat said...

    What part of what I've said is not factual.

    The part I'm guessing about is Romney out-raising Obama, which I think will happen.

    Nothing of what you said was based in fact. It was all opinion. One could easily argue that Al Gore and John Kerry were both more articulate and better "campaigners" than George W. Bush. One could argue that HW bush wins had Perot not gotten in the race.

    All you discussed was your opinion.

    In terms of what is going on today. It's as I predicted. It's an awful jobs report and everybody is focusing on that and not the convention. Most economists believe that as the debt cliff grows closer job creation will slow even more. Bernake will try to help by pumping MORE money into the fed but that won't effect jobs.

    hoptownukfan

  • CarlLexington said...

    I'm pointing my middle one at you right now.

    thumbsup

    WildcatGG24

  • ukaveman said...

    Only a liberal can spin the job numbers in a positive way. Nearly 4 times as many people just quit looking for work as were hired and the pathetic Obama economy continues to tank. Again, by this time in his administration, Reagan had added nearly 8 million new jobs in his recovery (yes Stepanie dumb blonde, 8 million is more than 4.5 million, nice try). The whole point is that after a steep recession, the economy is supposed to have a more robust recovery. It's ok, we'll just put more and more folks on the public trough since the Dems think it's the best form of stimulus. You can't make this crap up!

    That's 8 million net new jobs in Reagan's economy. When you remove census hires there is virtually no new net jobs in the last 3+ years under obama.

    hoptownukfan

  • hoptownukfan said...

    You'd be surprised re: my democrat sources.

    Again, your speaking from an emotional-wishful thinking standpoint. You are looking at things from a non-fact based standpoint.

    Romney has outraised Obama at an amazing rate. As of the last report, Romney had 197 million on hand compared to 130 million for obama and the republican party had a drastically larger war chest. obama is actually spending faster than he is raising it. Not a big surprise there... He's good at that.

    hoptownukfan

  • hoptownukfan said...

    Romney has outraised Obama at an amazing rate. As of the last report, Romney had 197 million on hand compared to 130 million for obama and the republican party had a drastically larger war chest. obama is actually spending faster than he is raising it. Not a big surprise there... He's good at that.

    Your numbers are accurate regarding what the campaigns, plus parties, plus friendly SuperPacs have on hand. Obama has spent more because Romney couldn't spend much of his until he got the nomination. They've raised roughly the same with the Dem's having a slight advantage and Obama, the candidate, having a huge edge over Romney the candidate.

    You're so big on facts, it seems like you'd consult one every now and then.

    This post was edited by djkycat54906 on 9/7/2012 at 11:05 AM

    The 2012 Money Race: Compare the Candidates - Election 2012 - NYTimes.com

    Massachusetts Republican Primary: Latest election results, polls and updates for the 2012 presidential election.

    elections.nytimes.com

    djkycat54906

  • hoptownukfan said...

    Nothing of what you said was based in fact. It was all opinion. One could easily argue that Al Gore and John Kerry were both more articulate and better "campaigners" than George W. Bush. One could argue that HW bush wins had Perot not gotten in the race.

    that's not the post you accused me of injecting opinion (by quoting my post).

    And while I was using some opinion in the post you now are arguing with, however it is a concensus opinion that Reagan, Clinton, Nixon, and Obama are/were great campaigners. Nobody is going to say that about either Bush or Kerry or Gore. As I said, we've had a lot of duds vs. duds.

    No one is going to say that Romney is anywhere near Obama in terms of political chops. If Obama loses, and it's entirely possible he will, it will be the first time that a clearly superior politician has lost the race--it doesn't matter what shoulda or coulda happened in the past.

    djkycat54906

  • CarlLexington said...

    It's hard to have a robust recovery when the extreme right are obstructing the recovery. It's brilliant. Impede, obstruct everything that could help the recovery and then blame Obama. It's been the agenda the entire time. And despite that we're still adding jobs month after month and the economy is recovering step by step. Obama should be commended for doing what he has for the economy facing that mountain and the republican leaders in the house and senate should be brought up on charges of treason, because that's exactly what they are engaging in. They care more about their politics than they do the American people. That much is crystal clear. Next!

    It's hard to do anything when you are inept as a leader and you alienate folks from the get go. I just saw exceprts from Woodwards new book and it paints the annoited one as a petty, arrogant and ultimately incompetent leader. So w/that as the back drop, it's no wonder that we are where we are. When your first comment to the opposing party when they present an alternative to your proposal is "elections have consequences and I won" you are basically telling them to shove it! Yep, that's change we all can believe in! Leaders lead and this imbecile couldn't lead a group of 3rd graders to McDonalds to get a Happy Meal!

    ukaveman

  • ukaveman said...

    It's hard to do anything when you are inept as a leader and you alienate folks from the get go. I just saw exceprts from Woodwards new book and it paints the annoited one as a petty, arrogant and ultimately incompetent leader. So w/that as the back drop, it's no wonder that we are where we are. When your first comment to the opposing party when they present an alternative to your proposal is "elections have consequences and I won" you are basically telling them to shove it! Yep, that's change we all can believe in! Leaders lead and this imbecile couldn't lead a group of 3rd graders to McDonalds to get a Happy Meal!

    I look forward to reading the book. While you may have read some excerpts, what you are quoting has nothing to do with this book, which has to do with last summer's failed budget negotiations.

    Both sides were at the table trying to work something out like grown ups until the little children on the right (one of whom is now the vice presidential nominee) pitched a fit and made drunk uncle John come back home.

    djkycat54906

  • dj-ky-cat said...

    Your numbers are accurate regarding what the campaigns, plus parties, plus friendly SuperPacs have on hand. Obama has spent more because Romney couldn't spend much of his until he got the nomination. They've raised roughly the same with the Dem's having a slight advantage and Obama, the candidate, having a huge edge over Romney the candidate.

    You're so big on facts, it seems like you'd consult one every now and then.

    Cash on hand is what matters, not what you raise. Fundraising after citizens united is about how much your "team" has not what your "campaign" has. There are no lines of deliniation between the 3 (super pacs, parties, candidates) now. BTW, I disagree with citizens united.

    hoptownukfan

  • dj-ky-cat said...

    I look forward to reading the book. While you may have read some excerpts, what you are quoting has nothing to do with this book, which has to do with last summer's failed budget negotiations.

    Both sides were at the table trying to work something out like grown ups until the little children on the right (one of whom is now the vice presidential nominee) pitched a fit and made drunk uncle John come back home.

    Wow, that's not even close tot he truth.

    Obama and Boehner had reached an agreement. Obama came back and asked for more tax increases and Bohener walked away. Come on man. Get rid of the hyperbole and face the facts.

    In terms of your comments about the book. The quotes about what happened in the negotiations came straight out of the book. What are you even talking about?

    hoptownukfan

  • dj-ky-cat said...

    I look forward to reading the book. While you may have read some excerpts, what you are quoting has nothing to do with this book, which has to do with last summer's failed budget negotiations.

    Both sides were at the table trying to work something out like grown ups until the little children on the right (one of whom is now the vice presidential nominee) pitched a fit and made drunk uncle John come back home.

    The incident I sight below is supposedly in the book as well to frame the negotiating atmosphere that Obama had created w/House Republicans. And Hoptown is right, Obama and Boehner had reached a tentative framework then the Prez came back and asked for $400 billion more in revenue which was the deal breaker. So cocaine Barry and his dimwitted lib pals scuttled a very large deal all in the name of placating their base. Yep, that's real leadership!

    By Marc A. Thiessen
    Monday, October 25, 2010

    The decline of the Obama presidency can be traced to a meeting at the White House just three days after the inauguration, when the new president gathered congressional leaders of both parties to discuss his proposed economic stimulus. House Republican Whip Eric Cantor gave President Obama a list of modest proposals for the bill. Obama said he would consider the GOP ideas, but told the assembled Republicans that "elections have consequences" and "I won." Backed by the largest congressional majorities in decades, the president was not terribly interested in giving ground to his vanquished adversaries.

    ukaveman

  • hoptownukfan said...

    Wow, that's not even close tot he truth.

    Obama and Boehner had reached an agreement. Obama came back and asked for more tax increases and Bohener walked away. Come on man. Get rid of the hyperbole and face the facts.

    In terms of your comments about the book. The quotes about what happened in the negotiations came straight out of the book. What are you even talking about?

    That's Boehner's side of it, but Woodward also tells Obama's side of it--both apparently taken from personal interviews so obviously subject to the teller's interpretation. Two different stories, except for Boehner being the one to walk away

    djkycat54906

  • dj-ky-cat said...

    That's Boehner's side of it, but Woodward also tells Obama's side of it--both apparently taken from personal interviews so obviously subject to the teller's interpretation. Two different stories, except for Boehner being the one to walk away

    It's been wildly reported that Obama pulled the rug out from under Boehner. They reached an agreement. Both went back to sell to their folks. Obama came back after boehner had sold to his folks and changed the rules. Common sense says that Boehner walks away as he should have at that point.

    We don't have a revenue problem in our country. We have a spending problem.

    i agree with eliminating loopholes for the wealthiest but we already have the most progressive tax system in terms of proportion of taxes paid in the world.

    hoptownukfan

  • Here are the facts on the jobs report from today. Unemployment rate dropped but that's not because more people are working, it's because more people have given up on seeking work. 300,000+ people left the labor force this month. That's an astonishing #.

    To put this in more perspective, If you used the labor participation rate from 2009 and applied it to today's employment #'s the unemployment rate would be ABOVE 11%. that's an astonishing #. Only by the fact that the economy is SOOOO bad that people have completly given up is the unemployment rate down. The fact is, fewer people are working. Sad situation. Hard to fathom people thinking that we should stick with the same course. We don't need bushenomics either, we need regannomics. The kind of policies that HELP create millions of jobs.

    This post was edited by hoptownukfan on 9/7/2012 at 2:39 PM

    hoptownukfan

  • Here are the exact #'s.

    According to James Pethokoukis of the American Enterprise Institute, the unemployment rate would be 11.2 per cent if the labour force participation rate had remained what it was when Obama took office in January 2009. The U.S. Labour Department also said that 41,000 fewer jobs were created in June and July than previously reported.

    hoptownukfan

  • hoptownukfan said...

    Wishful thinking redux...

    doesn't even deserve a response. This is a base election. ALL factors were in Obama's favor four years ago. that included independents like me voting for him. His base was fired up too. With all of those factors in his favor he got 53% of the vote.

    Four years later and Almost ALL of those factors are working against him. Great campaigner or not, he's facing a strong headwind.

    Folks I know on the democratic side have told me that Obama has all but written Florida off. They will fight there, but they have a huge uphill battle there. (remember, his margin was razor thin 4 years ago in Florida) They are also becoming more convinced that Iowa is not looking good. Ohio is a true tossup as is Wisconsin. Colorado is also almost certainly back in republican hands.

    All signs point to the election being decided in Virginia and Ohio. The difference in those states will be turnout. Republicans are motivated, democrats and independents are not.

    If the election were held today it would be amazingly close.

    this is not at all an accurate depiction of where the race stands today.

    check the links, everybody will find some great information.

    on the wikipedia page check the section under 2008 Election results.

    this guy is pretty damn good at what he does.

    Election Forecasts - FiveThirtyEight Blog - NYTimes.com

    FiveThirtyEight is devoted to rigorous analysis of politics, polling, public affairs, sports, science and culture, largely through statistical means.

    fivethirtyeight.blogs.nytimes.com

    Romney cedes Ohio TV airwaves to Obama (at least for now)

    If you switched on a television in northern Ohio this week, chances are you saw an ad for President Obama's reelection campaign. Mitt Romney? Nothing.

    www.latimes.com

    FiveThirtyEight - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/FiveThirtyEight

    en.wikipedia.org

    goldenbearcatz

  • ukaveman said...

    The incident I sight below is supposedly in the book as well to frame the negotiating atmosphere that Obama had created w/House Republicans. And Hoptown is right, Obama and Boehner had reached a tentative framework then the Prez came back and asked for $400 billion more in revenue which was the deal breaker. So cocaine Barry and his dimwitted lib pals scuttled a very large deal all in the name of placating their base. Yep, that's real leadership!

    By Marc A. Thiessen
    Monday, October 25, 2010

    The decline of the Obama presidency can be traced to a meeting at the White House just three days after the inauguration, when the new president gathered congressional leaders of both parties to discuss his proposed economic stimulus. House Republican Whip Eric Cantor gave President Obama a list of modest proposals for the bill. Obama said he would consider the GOP ideas, but told the assembled Republicans that "elections have consequences" and "I won." Backed by the largest congressional majorities in decades, the president was not terribly interested in giving ground to his vanquished adversaries.

    Just wondering how what Obama said is different from what Bush said days after the 2004 election, 'I have earned political capital and I intend to spend it' not exact quote but damn close

    The only difference I see is that Obama won by a much larger popular vote percentage and electoral vote share in 2008 than Bush did in 2004. Not to mention he also had heavy majorities in the HoR and Senate

    goldenbearcatz

  • goldenbearcatz said...

    this is not at all an accurate depiction of where the race stands today.

    check the links, everybody will find some great information.

    on the wikipedia page check the section under 2008 Election results.

    this guy is pretty damn good at what he does.

    Huh? What I said has been backed up by multiple non-partisan pundits. What you cited was "ok" at predicting races at best.

    What I said regarding enthusiasm and the change in turnout this time will have a huge effect on the race. Whereas four years ago Obama had a HUGE wind at his back, he now faces a strong head wind. He also faces a situaiin where he has a motivated opposition instead of an apathetic opposition.

    This election is eerily similar to 200;. It's a "base" electIon. Republicans have won the last 3 or 4 "base" elections. Why? Because America is a center/right country.

    hoptownukfan

  • goldenbearcatz said...

    this is not at all an accurate depiction of where the race stands today.

    check the links, everybody will find some great information.

    on the wikipedia page check the section under 2008 Election results.

    this guy is pretty damn good at what he does.

    Did you even read the article about the Ohio ad buy? Anybody who understands politics knows that the opposing party usually dials back their campaign during the opposing campaigns convention.

    Just wait.

    hoptownukfan

  • I didn't read through all that but did hop or any of the others on the right here mention that unemployment fell again to 8.1%? I'm betting they didn't.

    signature image

    CarlLexington

  • Unemployment dropped to 8.1% not because we ADDED jobs but because nearly 400,000 people DROPPED off the roles looking for work. 92,000 hires doesn't even keep up with population growth. The US labor participation rate is at its lowest point in 30 years!! So regardless of how positively any lib wants to spin it, the jobs report for August was a debacle pure and simple.

    ukaveman

  • ukaveman said...

    Unemployment dropped to 8.1% not because we ADDED jobs but because nearly 400,000 people DROPPED off the roles looking for work. 92,000 hires doesn't even keep up with population growth. The US labor participation rate is at its lowest point in 30 years!! So regardless of how positively any lib wants to spin it, the jobs report for August was a debacle pure and simple.

    Debacle is extreme. It's not good. I agree. But pretending like it's the end of the western world as we know it is a bit much dontcha think? lol But as I've said before, it's jobs added instead of losing 100's of 1000's a month as we were under Bush. And as we will under another republican President. Especially one like Mitt Romney who has 17 of his 21 advisers being former Bush men. Looking at monthly reports like they are the be all end all is stupid no matter what they say. If things went the other way and we added 500K jobs and the unemployment rate fell to 6% you guys would find some way to spin it into it wasn't Obama's doing. But when it's not glowing you sure do have a lot of blame for him.

    signature image

    CarlLexington

  • Hey Carl, how do you know that the 4 advisors that were changed weren't the only 4 Bush would listen to? Lol

    stillDA23

  • stillDA23 said...

    Hey Carl, how do you know that the 4 advisors that were changed weren't the only 4 Bush would listen to? Lol

    Because they all told Dubya what he wanted to hear. Dubya only surrounded himself with yes men.

    signature image

    CarlLexington